Bled The Brakes on my LIKE200i

[Stig / Major Tom]

My scoot is nearing its second birthday (owned 1 yr, but sat in dealer's since April 2012)...so figured the brake fluid is 2 yrs old. Kymco says to change it after 2 yrs. No issues with the brakes - just time to do it.
Warm enough today to be prying at the plastics, so did my first ever (on any vehicle - !) brake bleed.
Bought a mighty vac from amazon to do the "one man" brake bleed. If the hose would have sealed better on the little Kymco nipple - might have not needed a 3rd hand. Now I have to pitch to my daughter for 2 hrs to pay her back for helping.
 Before you begin, read through the steps, look at the pictures - maybe watch a youtube video.
Take your time and enjoy working on your scooter!
STEPS:
Remove negative terminal from the battery.(If I short something while mucking about with the wires I'd be p_ssed!)
Remove the mirrors.
Remove the front turn stalks w/12mm wrench, let them hang carefully.
Remove the 4 screws which hold together the front and back halves of the headlight / dashboard assembly clamshell.


With the pizza cutter (or very thin paint scraper or thin nylon automotive interior panel tool) gently pry up the front cover - and pull down and back the rear cover. 3 tabs holding them.


With the 2 halves apart - unscrew the 2 phillips screws holding the headlight / handlebar-cover to the frame.


The headlight section is still clipped at the bottom - with your fingers undo these 2 clips from the pegs. Let both halves hang gently - no need to unhook anything!


The reservoirs are uncovered now. Put plenty of rags around the area - brake fluid removes paint! Remove the 2 screws from the lid on the reservoir, and set aside the 3 pieces.


Locate the brake bleeder nipple, and remove the rubber cover completely from the nipple - this gives you more room for the 8mm wrench and the drain tube to attach to the nipple.


Put the 8mm wrench on the nipple.


Put your tube on the nipple with your wrench....pump the Mighty Vac to create suction on the nipple.
Crack open the bleeder nipple to draw some fluid from the line and the reservoir into the Mighty Vac. Observe the reservoir - do NOT let it run dry - keep adding new fluid until you see new fluid coming into the Might Vac holding tank. You can bleed your old brake fluid and add new without using a Mighty Vac by pumping , pulling and holding the brake lever while cracking open the bleed valve - with a hose attached and running into a container of fluid. Repeat until new fluid is seen in your container and all airbubbles have stopped showing in the drain tube. Close the bleeder nipple before letting go of the brake lever, so that old fluid and any air is leaving the lines and none is returning.


Do not fill above the fill mark on the reservoir tank. You can see that KYMCO/China did not fill to the fill line. (Both reservoirs were found to be this way, upon delivery)


The rear brake is a tight fit - but it can be bled just like the front. There is room to move the wrench to open and close the nipple. Nothing has to be removed to do the rear brake except that rubber cap and collar.


The tools I used. DOT 4 brake fluid is specified in my LIKE200i owner's manual.
.


Take your time replacing the plastic, lights and mirrors....screws into plastic do not have to be overly tight!
And use plenty of rags to protect the finish of your scooter!

Questions? Thanks Troutbum for correcting my procedure.
Ride safe!
Stig (still learning)

[TroutBum]

Is there a bleeder nipple at the reservoir as well? How much fluid did you run through it to flush it out?
A trick I learned years ago is to use a syringe and remove the oil out of the reservoir but don't let the fluid drop below the 1/3rd level. This methods makes replacing oil at the upper end faster. Whatever you do don't completely drain the reservoir as you'll introduce air to the system and especially the banjo bolt which is a pain to remove the air.

[big blue]

That is a really nice report Stig and as usual great pictures. But why a pizza wheel? Is that the Italian connection? Thanks for the tutorial!

[Stig / Major Tom]

That is a really nice report Stig and as usual great pictures. But why a pizza wheel? Is that the Italian connection? Thanks for the tutorial!

Thanks,
The pizza cutter is THE essential tool here....the remainder could be done with a drinking straw, 2 paper clips , a ball peen hammer and a Dr Pepper. (see "Red Green Ruins a Piaggio", youtube)
My putty knives were too thick, a steak knife is too scary, simple squeezing didn't work -  The pizza cutter slid in there without marking the panel and is nice and broad to spread the prying action. Brilliant! (It came to me like a Vision.) These sessions would be better if I could figure out how to shoot a video.
One more thing : PUMP the brake lever several times then pull and hold while you crack the bleeder open.

[Stig / Major Tom]

Is there a bleeder nipple at the reservoir as well? How much fluid did you run through it to flush it out?
A trick I learned years ago is to use a syringe and remove the oil out of the reservoir but don't let the fluid drop below the 1/3rd level. This methods makes replacing oil at the upper end faster. Whatever you do don't completely drain the reservoir as you'll introduce are to the system and especially the banjo bolt which is a pain to remove the air.

No nipple at the reservoir. I just kept going on the bleeding until I was certain I was seeing clear fluid.....no idea how much. I used maybe 4/5ths of the Prestone Dot 4 in flushing the two reservoirs.  I was afraid to syringe any out - because I didn't know how fast it was going to rush out. Scared to start pulling air into the llines. Next time I will take some out with a syringe on this scoot - but if working on a different one (some day, I hope) I'd probably be this cautious again.
No Eye-Deer what a banjo bolt is - but glad I didn't have to mess with it.
I think I should have looked through all the tubes and fittings that came with this Mighty Vac - there probably was a smaller diameter tube I could have fitted which would have stuck to the nipple better. The M.V. was a bit overwhelming - must be a couple dozen parts in the kit! and a good sized book - which I will read some day when I get Malaria.
Anyway, it all turned out OK for my 1st shot at this. (I owned a few cars for 20+ yrs - never flushed the brake fluid)
One more thing - PUMP the brake lever several times then pull & hold while you crack the bleedr valve!

[TroutBum]

Why pump the brake when using the Mityvac? The vacuum created with the pump is used to draw the fluid out of the system.

[Stig / Major Tom]

Why pump the brake when using the Mityvac? The vacuum created with the pump is used to draw the fluid out of the system.

You're absolutely correct Troutbum!
As this was my first Goat-Roping with brake bleeding - I ended up doing both - pumping and pulling in the brake levers while cracking the bleeder nipple - and having a vaccum pumped into the MightVac at the same time. Re-pumped the M.V. between each cracking-lever-pulling.
I actually never tried cracking the nipple after drawing a vacuum with the M.V.....always added the lever-pull. I guess it would have pulled it out a lot faster than what I was getting. Then I think you'd better have a 2nd person watching that reservoir in case the M.V. takes a big gulp out - and you accidentally emptied the tank!
I just wanted to make certain I did not get any air into the lines.....so, pumping the lever and sucking from the other end was a bit "belt and suspenders". So, you can do with with just 2 hands!
Hope I remember all of this 2 years from now when I do it again!
Thanks for your comment! I will modify my post.
Stig (still learning)

[TroutBum]

Wait until you have to change brake pads. That will be a learning experience. When I did it years ago for the first time on my motorcycles they didn't have YouTube. Yes, back in the Stone Age.  Thankfully we now have YouTube and portable devices.

[CROSSBOLT]

Stig, what  wonderful pictures and on screen notes! This set-up applies to all scoots with front and rear hydraulic brakes. Really neat and easy to follow. Thanks!

Karl

[sailorman]

OK, I just did this following above instructions and here is some feedback.
    Seems I didn't need a vacuum. Went to Walmart and bought a $3 item in their auto parts section called a "Hyper Tough Siphon Pump" (Item 36201WD).  A rubber bulb type siphon pump.  Turns out there is no valve inside the rubber bulb so it is useless for pulling a vacuum, but the generous supply of clear poly tubing included is EXACTLY the right size to fit firmly on the brake drain nipple.
     Used a paint scraper to pry rear cover off, as I did not have a pizza cutter handy.  New problem: the US turn signals do not allow the front cover to come off completely.  However a VERY careful bending allowed enough access to get the brake reservoir screws loosened and the covers off.  Removed old amber fluid (7 years old according to previous owner) with industrial syringe.  Then alternately pumped up brake, loosened nut, closed nut, added new fluid, pumped up brake, and repeat.  A scrunchy or heavy rubber band to hold brake handle down after pumping helped with the rear brake.  When clear fluid emerged in the poly tube, closed nut, filled reservoir to mark and reassembled.  Total time, one hour.  Thanks Stig for clear instructions!

[Stig / Major Tom]

One hour?!! Well done - you!
My coffee breaks totalled more than that.
Spent that long worrying the plastics apart...but panels were more robust and not as easily broken as I'd feared.
Kinda of a fun scooter to monkey with...esp. so if kept clean and free of corrosion.
Stig

[Viper254]

OK, I just did this following above instructions and here is some feedback.
    Seems I didn't need a vacuum. Went to Walmart and bought a $3 item in their auto parts section called a "Hyper Tough Siphon Pump" (Item 36201WD).  A rubber bulb type siphon pump.  Turns out there is no valve inside the rubber bulb so it is useless for pulling a vacuum, but the generous supply of clear poly tubing included is EXACTLY the right size to fit firmly on the brake drain nipple.
     Used a paint scraper to pry rear cover off, as I did not have a pizza cutter handy.  New problem: the US turn signals do not allow the front cover to come off completely.  However a VERY careful bending allowed enough access to get the brake reservoir screws loosened and the covers off.  Removed old amber fluid (7 years old according to previous owner) with industrial syringe.  Then alternately pumped up brake, loosened nut, closed nut, added new fluid, pumped up brake, and repeat.  A scrunchy or heavy rubber band to hold brake handle down after pumping helped with the rear brake.  When clear fluid emerged in the poly tube, closed nut, filled reservoir to mark and reassembled.  Total time, one hour.  Thanks Stig for clear instructions!

This is the way I've always done it - it takes a bit of getting used to, but takes a minimum of parts (hose, receptacle and bottle of fluid), there's no risk of getting air in if you're methodical about it and you know you're done when the new fluid starts to come out of the bleed valve.

I've got the calliper off my Honda SH50 at the moment. It's being a right pain in the backside - need a bench vice to get the pots back into the calliper, which is really annoying, as it means I have to take off the banjo bolt, which I'm usually mega-keen to avoid doing.

[dan v.]

You may be able to weasel in a small "C" clamp to press the piston back in, saving you from having to remove the caliper. 

[CROSSBOLT]

What Dan V said. I have even used channel-lock type pliers with thin wood to prevent tooth-marks.

[Viper254]

You may be able to weasel in a small "C" clamp to press the piston back in, saving you from having to remove the caliper.

Good call but it's having none of it. Calliper rebuild appears to be due