KymcoForum.com
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: wassonii on June 30, 2012, 12:43:27 PM
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Hello all.
I have been addressing this issue in the Like 50 area, but want to know if anyone else might have a thought on this.
I ride a Like 50 2t and recently installed a Jasil/Top Racing variator. An issue I had had was yesterday after installation (and an initial startup that went well) incurring a grinding sound with no start. This morning I went into the case and discovered that the ramp plate was 'stuck' on the shaft. It's inner diameter was slightly thinner than the OEM (about the thickness of paint, which I scraped off). After making sure of good fitment, I reinstalled the vari and my fasteners are all attached well, but on start-up, there was a grinding sound still (though the engine does turn over and it appears that the cvt is turning). From what I can tell, the bendix is not disengaging once the engine starts. I am assuming this because that is the location of the sound, the kickstart shaft has some movement after startup, and there are some fine metal flakes under the bendix. The washer has been in place each time I return the cover. I did start the engine yesterday with the cover off (and without making sure the bendix was retained), but at that time, the engined turned over well and CVT pulleys turned freely.
Any thoughts or experiences are greatly appreciated.
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Given my most recent investigations, what may be happening is that the new vari is slightly 'thicker' than the OEM and is causing the vari face to protrude just enough to catch the kickstart gear. The bendix, with manual manipulation, travels well and is not hanging up. When the case is fully bolted and the scooter kickstarted, the kickstart lever tries to continue to travel. I don't have time for further investigations just now, but those are my immediate thoughts and findings. The sound may better be described as a 'clicking/rubbing/kind of grinding' sound coming from the area where the bendix protrudes/kickstarter gear engages.
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Can you not pull out the bendix, refit the cover and try kickstart it? Least then if the noise goes away you know if its the bendix, if its still there then you know the bendix isnt hitting?
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take the kickk start cover off and clean realy realy good .the hole that the bendix hits when it shots out to start the bike might be filled with dirt and its grinding on gear wheels. I broke mine doing that all I had to do is clean it good. I know its not much but sometimes a clean scoot is a happy scoot.
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I am fairly certain that the bendix is good. Yesterday after install, I think I didn't have it seated properly, though I will def make sure the hole is debris-free.
I just got back to the house, so haven't had a chance to remove bendix and try lone kickstarting since sending my last missive.
I had noticed some rub spots on some of the fan blades and teeth of the kickstarter gear (cover side) on the last time under the cover.
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I think I posted on the other thread that the cvt gasket is too thin now. Adding a second/third gasket will allow clearance. But the question is Why is it "thicker"?
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I just shot this info over at the other discussion, but so it is here, too:
The Jasil boss is 39mm where the OEM is 38mm. That, coupled with a slightly taller ramp plate makes the distance 1-2+mm more, causing the fan and likely the gear on fixed plate catch the kick gear at the cover. I have swapped back to the OEM vari and it runs fine.
For the record, I did follow the other suggestions of cleaning the bendix hole and removing the bendix to see if kick would start before embarking on complete removal/replacement.
Also, for what it's worth, the OEM boss does not fit the Jasil vari (too thick, but only just)
Many thanks to Strido, Blue, and Zombie!
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I just shot this info over at the other discussion, but so it is here, too:
The Jasil boss is 39mm where the OEM is 38mm. That, coupled with a slightly taller ramp plate makes the distance 1-2+mm more, causing the fan and likely the gear on fixed plate catch the kick gear at the cover. I have swapped back to the OEM vari and it runs fine.
For the record, I did follow the other suggestions of cleaning the bendix hole and removing the bendix to see if kick would start before embarking on complete removal/replacement.
Also, for what it's worth, the OEM boss does not fit the Jasil vari (too thick, but only just)
Many thanks to Strido, Blue, and Zombie!
If you can access a set of calipers or gauge to measure the width of the Jasil hole accurately you can just lathe down the 38mm boss you have so it fits, if you can get a shot of a lathe or know a friendly machine shop guy, its a quick job so shouldnt cost much if you have to pay.
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All this cross posting... Gotta combine/kill one. Trimming/shimming the Jasil will get it.
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..did i reply or did i not...
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Cross-posting sure beats cross-dressing, tho I do look good in a skirt.
wordslinger, you just did...and thank you!
I may have access to a machinist, actually.
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...Cross-posting sure beats cross-dressing, tho I do look good in a skirt
..oh scooter gods, make wassonii be a girl....
...please!!
;D
..or at least wearing a kilt!!
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utili-kilt all the way (but not on the scoot)
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..theres gotta be a kilt wearing scootist out there somewhere...
..VIVO!...
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..theres gotta be a kilt wearing scootist out there somewhere...
..VIVO!...
I got married in a kilt, Robertson Hunting Tartan, during the Braveheart days our clan ran with the Robertson's so we wore their colours. Could post up my wedding photos but i dont want you all touching yourselves.
I may have access to a machinist, actually.
He should be able to take that skirt in for you then?
What?
Oh, its not that kind of machinist :P
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I'm touching myself right now... What'cha wearin'
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I got married in a kilt
..pics, please..................
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I'm touching myself right now... What'cha wearin'
My kilt. And i got my sporran out too.
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I love a big sporran covered with spotted dick. (for gods sake I better be a chick)
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..theres gotta be a kilt wearing scootist out there somewhere...
..VIVO!...
(http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRJWyXgfZEMAy05IwF_WTtHK3uEKPsGd_2X-xl5YmsB6nrV5DKKm5I_yBv2HQ)
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Nuyce!
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No kilts or skirts, but I found a local machine shop that knocked the boss down to 37.94mm for me at no charge. Got into a great discussion about Cushman scooters, to boot. They typically work on engine blocks and cylinders, but were very kind and did it while I waited. I'm waiting for nuts to arrive before a second attack on the vari, but thank you again for the help and suggestions!
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No kilts or skirts, but I found a local machine shop that knocked the boss down to 37.94mm for me at no charge. Got into a great discussion about Cushman scooters, to boot. They typically work on engine blocks and cylinders, but were very kind and did it while I waited. I'm waiting for nuts to arrive before a second attack on the vari, but thank you again for the help and suggestions!
So all you took off it was 0.06mm? I doubt you will see much if any difference from that or it being at 38mm. Mine is 36.8mm, 1.2mm shorter, would think you will need at least 0.5mm off it to see/feel any real difference at all. :-\
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It was at 39mm prior to hitting the lathe. The stock was 38mm.
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I figured it would be best to err on the side of caution as I can return to remove more if necessary and then, if too much is removed, I should be okay to shim the boss.
I won't be able to try reassembly until the weekend at the earliest due to work scheduling and as the nuts arn't due to arrive until around then (or shortly thereafter due to the holiday) I shall wait until they arrive.
I wrote to Steve at Moped Hospital (the purveyor from whom I purchased the variator) and asked if he had incurred any such problems with installation on a Like 50 and he wrote that he had successfully (and without alteration) installed the same make of variator on a Like with no issue, though it was just after the Like had been introduced to the American market. He wondered if there hadn't been some slight difference made to the Like's CVT assembly in the production's interim.
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My mistake, i had it in my head you had an A50, just as well one of us is on the ball ;)
Those sizes were for an Agility so if the like also has a stock boss length of 38mm the 39mm boss wouldnt be right for it, should feel better now its just under the 38mm and back to stock length hopefully. As you said you can just shave a little off at a time if it feels it could use more. Dont think i would take it down too much tho.
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No sir! Steady as she goes. I thought about it when I read in wordslinger's post 'malossi v. naraku' in the Super 9 section and he referred to the malossi's boss as being 37.5mm, but figure that a little at a time is best. Besides, they are some good folks at the machine shop.
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Very productive... Can't wait to see it together.
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Not quite as productive as you, sir. That ZX is going to be a war machine when all is said and done! Progress, though...always trying to make some progress!
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A bit of tentative success. I wanted to wait for new nuts (arrived yesterday) and spring (arrived this morning) to tackle the whole. Under the threat of impending rain, I got it all put together and buttoned up when the first sprinkles arrived. She started right up and I was able to drive it a little bit before the rain really started coming down. I'll do my test runs between rain showers, but had to say thank you to you all.
The lathing did its' job well. It's odd, I know, but that 1mm made a big enough difference for proper fitment. From what I have been reading around the forum, this scoot isn't the only one Kymco has been 'adjusting' in later production runs.
Och well, all good for now. I'll continue progress reports over in the Like 50 section.
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8) 8) 8)