Oh Crap

[MoToFaLcon]

I think ive done something horrible.  Bought a brand spankin new 2013 Agility 50 for $1800 and at 285km did an oil changed and used some castrol edge syntec 10w40 full synthetic.  Still have that in engine all the way up to 825km.  The dealer recommended full synthetic after 300km, that was after i asked him about using dino oil for break in.  He said nah use full syn itll be fine.  But got to researching lately and now i kinda think using full synthetic was a mistake.  Some ppl say dino oil for break in is for older engines and does not apply to new engines that have been machined with state of the art equipment that exists today.  But then i read about motomans hard engine break in method on his website that clearly states absolutely no synthetic oil for any engine break in wat so ever.  So im like crap!  1800 bucks and im f'n up my scooter!!  About to switch to dino asap i think.  Maybe like a shell rotella or something cheap.  Any thoughts or opinions would be greatly appreciated.  P.S.  Been using masterpro chemicals gl-5 80w90 for gear oil, thats probably wrong too?? Anything better?  Thanks for your time.

[Stig / Major Tom]

1) Engine Oil.
2) Break in procedure.
3) Gear oil.

You're gonna notice that opinions regarding subjects #1 & #2 are like belly buttons. (everybody's got one)
People I trust say this : Use good oil & change it often. The important thing is to change it ! Period!
                                    Break it in per the owner's manual.
                                    #3.....80/90 gear oil is good. Change it per your manual.
Follow the book written by the people who made your scooter ("owner's manual") they specify what weight & grade of oil to use in your engine and transmission. Reg or Synthetic oils ??- not a game changer - just don't use crap and change it as scheduled (or more often)
Other than that, my advice is to relax and cover your brakes when it gets dicey with the cagers.
Stig

[MoToFaLcon]

Great answer stig, feel better already.  In the manual, it says use a premium quality 4 stroke engine oil with sj api rating.  Viscosity 15w40, if not use alternate viscosity 20w40-20w50, 15w40-15w50, 10w40, 10w30, or a 5w50.  For gear oil, pretty much just says to use a SAE 90 oil.  But anyways, i also did my own valve adjustment and set both at .04mm.  They dont say anything in the manual about that but was wondering if that sounds about right?  Under the back buddy seat, the 1 that flips up, has a sticker that says valves .06 +- .02mm so i just put to .04mm middle.  Also on sticker it says use unleaded 87 octane gas only.  Strange why they say only?  Heard premium 90 91 93 etc is best for 50cc scoots? 

[baddi]

Great answer stig, feel better already.  In the manual, it says use a premium quality 4 stroke engine oil with sj api rating.  Viscosity 15w40, if not use alternate viscosity 20w40-20w50, 15w40-15w50, 10w40, 10w30, or a 5w50.  For gear oil, pretty much just says to use a SAE 90 oil.  But anyways, i also did my own valve adjustment and set both at .04mm.  They dont say anything in the manual about that but was wondering if that sounds about right?  Under the back buddy seat, the 1 that flips up, has a sticker that says valves .06 +- .02mm so i just put to .04mm middle.  Also on sticker it says use unleaded 87 octane gas only.  Strange why they say only?  Heard premium 90 91 93 etc is best for 50cc scoots?

First of all, the reason you need to change the oil so often is because our engines has very little oil and has no positive crankcase ventilation system, so the oil is constantly contaminated by blow-by gasses. Then let's see at oils:
With synthetic oil, the manufacturers has much more control of the active ingredients that trap the blow-by gasses to prevent them from significantly change the viscocity very quickly. Semi-synthetic and mineral oils has also got these additives, but with synthetic oils, they have had much more control of the oil components.

What viscocity you should use depends on your weather. The first no. should be either 15, 10 or 5, depending on how cold an enviroment you live in, as a lower number means lover viscocity. The second number should be 40.

The "unleaded 87 octane only" is kinda strange, but i guess it has to do with how you measure octane as there are several different ways of doing it. Here in Denmark you can't get gas with lower than 92 octane and the agility manual sais 92 octane.
Of course you can use higher octane than recommended, but if your compression and ignition timing is made to a low octane fuel, a higher octane will have the same effect as retarding the ignition a bit, costing you power. This is because the higher octane fuel has a higher activation energy, so the flame front is moving slower through the combustion chamber and the mean cylinder pressure during the power stroke is lower as the highest pressure comes later, when the volume is bigger.

[mrmike]

  Many different opinions on this subject. I have a GTI300. At 100 miles I put 10-40 full synthetic in the motor and 75-90 full synthetic in the trans. No problems at all. I run full synthetic in all my cars, lawn mower, garden tractor, and snow thrower with no problems.


  Gasoline is another issue. My owners manual states 91 octane fuel. However there are different octane rating systems in the world. Our 87 octane is equal or higher octane than their 91, and runs just fine in my scooter.

[Resolve]

1) engine break in.  Following the manual is preferred, but I personally did not follow that.  Basically wide open when I first got since the roads I rode on wouldn't really allow otherwise.  but was like wide open for maybe a mile the stop and go lights then wide open for a while.  so Either wide open or nothing no in between. 

This worked for me and have about 8K km on it and no issues performance wise, just my recent start problem which was cdi related. 

As for valve adjustment .04 is correct for the agility.

2) Oil.  After first change I went full synthetic using Valvoline 4t motorcycle oil again no issues.  and gear oil was using 90w because I was able to get it from the part store.  but now they don't have straight 90w so I use 80W90.  Also Valvoline full synthetic.  again no issues.

If having no issues now I would suspect all is good.



As for break in I would recommend doing it per the manual in future.  Reason being I was at the local scooter shop and the mentioned that a person bought a Scooter believe it was a 200cc and drove it home and engine gave out.  they warrantied it and put new engine on it and guy drove it home and again engine failure.  problem was he was running it wide open across town and running at 70 plus and blowing the ring and damaging the internals. 

So moral is yes it can be broken in quickly, but not always.  So why chance messing something up versus normal suggested break in method and period.

[Vivo]

The octane rating on the manual (92, 93) is RON mostly used in Asia which is equivalent to 87 octane in the U.S. (RON+MON/2)...

[de dee]

  how I broke in my scooter,  by moto USA  the first 20 miles is to set in the rings, short fast runs , for compression, and fast slow downs for decompression, no gears on scooter so I used a steep hill,.after 20 miles you do as the book recommends,  and do it with dino oil,. oil changes were 20 miles,  40 miles 80 miles 160 miles and so on ,. at 600km. I changed oil still dino oil,.  and gear oil was changed to syn. after 1000 km. I stopped variating my speed,.  now I am very happy with my mobility scooter,.   300i down town,  80 years and loving it for over 41,000 km.

[MoToFaLcon]

Absolutely awesome, thanks for all your answers.  I guess itll be fine.  Now i cant wait until it warms up.  Like 11°F with 30mph gusts right now, burrr!!!!