roller weights with unlimited cdi ( more rpm )

[supercobrapaul]

Ok. So I get that lighter weights means faster take off and heavier mean more top end but......
When you remove the rev limiter , now what with more available rpm ?

I have a stock 04 S 9 L/C . I changed the variator to a koso and disconnected the rev limiter wire.
Result is better smooter low end pull but lost about 3-4 mph indicated
top speed . ( now 46 mph instead of 49-50 stock )
rollers may be 1 gram lighter. ( 7.5 )
Rpm still won't go over 8000 rpm with me on it. On the stand it does.
I weight 190 lbs.

Question is to get my speed up do I drop roller weight to rev past 8000 rpm
or use heavier weights to try to increase speed ?

I have just changed rollers to 5.5 but haven't tried it because I'm waiting for the weather
to clear.

Any thoughts ?

[thebatman]

Do you have the RS pipe on now or the OEM??
With my set up I beleive I have 5.5 in ATM
OEM vario w/5.5g
Motorio clutch w/ malossi red fly, UN-restricted rear pulley, red contra, OEM belt
no problem cruising 55 @ 9000

[supercobrapaul]

Right now I still have the stock pipe on. I guess I'll get her out tonight to see it I can break 8000 rpm.
If not I'll put the RS pipe on and see what difference it makes.

I have the cobra ( with the AC super 9 motor )which has the rs pipe on. I'm going to use it for parts.
I did order a T6 70cc bbk for it December 5th from an outfit in California who promised 7 day shipping in stock.
Still no sign of it !

That's why I went out and bought the Super 9 L/C. I needed a scoot to ride.
I had the cobra at 63 mph indicated with heavy weights 17mm carb, contra/clutch springs and such
running 9000-11000 rpm most of the time. You had to Fred Flintstone it to about 10mph but then it would fly !
But the compression was getting low and it was a pain to start ( just kick start )
So I have the parts to get the Super 9 L/C up and running good. The Cobra will have to wait !

Like I said I'll try with the stock pipe and 5.5's restriction off and see how that is first.
Always good to do one step at a time to see what does what. Just want to be able to break 8000 rpm to start !

Thanks for the reply ! Btw. What is the unrestricted rear pulley ?

[thebatman]

Like I said I'll try with the stock pipe and 5.5's restriction off and see how that is first.
Always good to do one step at a time to see what does what. Just want to be able to break 8000 rpm to start !

Thanks for the reply ! Btw. What is the unrestricted rear pulley ?

About 8000 is all you will get with the OEM pipe on there..
The RS pipe will help that. 

The rear pulley = The big pulley in the CVT at the rear wheel... The one the clutch is attached.......
On the inside you will see a big ass hump at the bottom of the pulley.. If the hump is present, the pulley is restricted...
It needs to be smooth all the way down.... A few of the Kymcos have them Un restricted but the s9 doesn't... The agility has a smooth one,

[supercobrapaul]

Managed to get the 9 out last night twice before the rain came.
The 5.5 rollers didn't help. Less pull low down and slower to to speed around 45.
Put the variator from the cobra in which has more aggressive ramps than the koso
with 8 gram rollers. Result solid torquey acceleration and 50 mph at 8000 rpm.
This makes sense as max torque 4.4 lb-ft is at 6500 rpm from what I've read.
I forgot to check for resticted rear pulley but I'm guessing its not given these
results.

I took the RS pipe off the cobra. Will put it on the 9 over the weekend and up jet
then report back.

[supercobrapaul]

Took the pipe off the cobra and realized it was made to fit with brackets and hangers that I dont want to put on the Super 9.
Was obvious made to fit and was originally on another bike, I guess ?
I'll keep it for the cobra when the T6 finally arrives.

Remembered I had an adjustable " racing " CDI I bought a while back that has been sitting around.
I will try that and see if I can get over 8000 rpm with the stock pipe. Read that the stock CDI even when the wire is pulled
basically kills the rpm with spark timing or such.

[supercobrapaul]

My new RS2 pipe for the super 9 lc is finally here, on hold at the post office
for me to pick up tonight !

I had some advice from thebatman to keep stock carb and change to 102 main jet.
I'll see how this works for me.

On a side note the Airsal T6 came for the cobra.
Cant get it to run past idle. New carb on the way as I think I did so much
changing of jets and needles that I screwed everything up.
Right now it just cuts out and seems to backfire ??

So two scoots to work on in the next week or so. My wife to be will be happy. LOL

[blue]

My money is on the 5.5 rollers

[zombie]

Ok. So I get that lighter weights means faster take off and heavier mean more top end but......

I couldn't get past the first sentence... Has this concept been sorted out in this thread? At the risk of repeating info. Lighter makes higher rpm, and heavier makes lower rpm. That's all. Too heavy reduces top end speed as does too light.
You have to have the engine running correctly before roller tuning can be done.
I hope I didn't repeat someone else's post.
I'll try to catch up now. I love ugly, stinky, good for nothing S9's

[supercobrapaul]

Zombie - Thanks.  Yeah that about covers it. Except that the pipe limits the rpm.
That is the issue. I'll see how much bottom end I loose with the RS2
and how much rpms I gain. BTW it runs freaking great as is !

[zombie]

Zombie - Thanks.  Yeah that about covers it. Except that the pipe limits the rpm.
That is the issue. I'll see how much bottom end I loose with the RS2
and how much rpms I gain. BTW it runs freaking great as is !

The pipe only works efficiently at a certain rpm range. Lots of other things limit rpm but not really the pipe.
Ign curve is the first, engine port timing is second, carb/pipe size is third, CVT is next, and pipe tuning is last.

If you cannot get over 8k, and you want to get over 8k... It's not the pipe

If other S-9's have your same cylinder, and beat 8k, it's not the cylinder (unless it's worn)
How about the CDI... Same story except for the wear part.

Maybe you have a restricter or in the pipe?

[supercobrapaul]

Put a new tecnigas rs2 on. Up~jetted. Put a known good unrestricted cdi on. ( lets my cobra do 10500 rpm all day long ). Still wont break 8000 rpm and 50 mph. Noticed my variator plate was a little tight on the shaft,. Will change it out. Tried 5.5, 6.5 and 7.5 rollers. Still 50 mph @8000. Acceleration changes but top speed / rpm does not. Beats me. No restriction on pipe ( at least not at the flange ) engine has good compression 3k miles.

[zombie]

Which belt? Also try lighter rollers. Maybe from 3.5 - 5gr. In different set ups I can run from 3 - 8.5gr rollers, and still top out around 13.5k. Everything HAS to balance to work. Get an OEM Bando belt, then try lighter rollers if that don't sort it out.

I'm not sure but I do remember some talk about S9's having a limiter that you cannot bypass. try searching Aeromyst, and Wordslingers posts on S9's. Maybe it's in there somewhere. I think a Naraku or Nakaru CDI was the solution.

Email Josh at The scooter garage. He'll know.