Electric starter works but kick start doesn't

[Cokym]

I changed my Agility's motor oil few weeks ago and then noticed that kicking doesn't start the engine no more. It almost makes it run and few rare occasions it has started for few seconds bu kicking.

Electric starter works and the scooter usually start with the first try.

Then this thing escalated and it didn't start with either one. I check spark, it was okey. Cleaned carburetor and adjusted valves. Checked electric richer that it works. Checked that there were no air leaks in the manifold or elsewhere in the carburetor. Now I got it to the point as it was earlier, so electric starter works but kick starter almost makes the engine run but will fail after several attempts. I have opened the variator several times and cleaned and oiled things accordingly and all is fine "down there" and the kick start seems to be working as it should, but it just doesn't get the engine going...

I got a hint elsewhere to check compression for the cylinder cos there might be leak in the cylinder head gasket perhaps. But I don't have a gauge for this test.

Has anyone else had similar symptoms and what else should i still check?

ps. long time lurker, first time poster.

[MN_Scoot]

How old is your bike?

My first thought was needing a new spark wire. Mine became so brittle after a few years, it basically fell apart. But if you are certain you have spark and your plug is gapped correctly, I would guess it's likely a fuel delivery issue. Can you see if there is fuel in the filter? The fuel petcocks on these sometimes seize up especially after a long period of storage and your carb will get no gas. You can get those here: http://www.partsforscooters.com

Any other variables? How long did it sit before this oil change? You say it did work for a while after the oil change? Did it ever start after cleaning your carb? Did you tune the fuel/air mix screw when you put it back together?

[Cokym]

Bike is from 2011. It is 4T with roughly 7600km in the meter.

I took it out of the winter hibernation like a month before the oil change and it worked before and after the oil change albeit starting was getting tougher after it and then I noticed that the kick start was not getting the job done no more. Kick start used to be surest way to get the scoot going when temperatures were low.
About the variables;
I did put maybe a bit too much oil in the change and took out some oil after few days so that the level was at the middle of the oil stick and not little over the max level.
After the hibernation i did drive few days until I noticed that i needed to add some motor oil (2dl) and transmission oil.

There is indeed spark in the plug, though i am not sure if the spark is strong enough cos I can't compare it to anything. The plug is a Iridium one and cap is right. Carb gets gas so I did not yet clean the gas filter nor check the petcock. Filter is not transparent so I can't see if there is gas there. But I guess there is. Going to check/clean those next then.
I have also changed the air filter to a new one at the same time I changed oil.

The scoot is still starting from the electric starter. I have tuned few times the fuel/air mix and going to still do it more precisely soon.
Intake valve was roughly 0.05mm and exhaust valve under that. I put both to roughly 0.08mm, which is the recommended value here in north. I have order already a new spark wire. There was little brittle in it in the top cover but there seems to be an extra cover underneath it.
I have cleaned the variator and kick start system, bendix etc. and put some grease to the places that require it.

Edit: I also changed the battery after the hibernation cos the old one was pretty done. Got a new 7Ah one to replace the 4Ah original.

[MN_Scoot]

Bike is from 2011. It is 4T with roughly 7600km in the meter.

I took it out of the winter hibernation like a month before the oil change and it worked before and after the oil change albeit starting was getting tougher after it and then I noticed that the kick start was not getting the job done no more. Kick start used to be surest way to get the scoot going when temperatures were low.
About the variables;
I did put maybe a bit too much oil in the change and took out some oil after few days so that the level was at the middle of the oil stick and not little over the max level.
After the hibernation i did drive few days until I noticed that i needed to add some motor oil (2dl) and transmission oil.

There is indeed spark in the plug, though i am not sure if the spark is strong enough cos I can't compare it to anything. The plug is a Iridium one and cap is right. Carb gets gas so I did not yet clean the gas filter nor check the petcock. Filter is not transparent so I can't see if there is gas there. But I guess there is. Going to check/clean those next then.
I have also changed the air filter to a new one at the same time I changed oil.

The scoot is still starting from the electric starter. I have tuned few times the fuel/air mix and going to still do it more precisely soon.
Intake valve was roughly 0.05mm and exhaust valve under that. I put both to roughly 0.08mm, which is the recommended value here in north. I have order already a new spark wire. There was little brittle in it in the top cover but there seems to be an extra cover underneath it.
I have cleaned the variator and kick start system, bendix etc. and put some grease to the places that require it.

Edit: I also changed the battery after the hibernation cos the old one was pretty done. Got a new 7Ah one to replace the 4Ah original.

When you cleaned/greased, did you put grease on the cylinder seen at the top of this photo? (this is the part that sits in/spins in the transmission cover. Cleaning/greasing this solved my kickstarter problem before. http://www.bikescooterparts.com/7145-8050-large/kickstarter-tandwiel-kymco-agility.jpg

If that part is not clean and greased and won't be able to spin out and turn the engine. Does it feel like it is turning the engine when you use the foot crank?

[Cokym]

When you cleaned/greased, did you put grease on the cylinder seen at the top of this photo? (this is the part that sits in/spins in the transmission cover. Cleaning/greasing this solved my kickstarter problem before. http://www.bikescooterparts.com/7145-8050-large/kickstarter-tandwiel-kymco-agility.jpg

If that part is not clean and greased and won't be able to spin out and turn the engine. Does it feel like it is turning the engine when you use the foot crank?

Yep, I did clean it and grease it and  the kick is spinning the engine and almost making it start.  So i think it is not a mechanical problem with the kick start system.
(Cleaning and greasing the ring and the track in the part at the pic did solve my problem of kick start not returning after a kick.)

Imo the problem must be on the fuel system or some sort of compression problem.  I suppose I have to just keep digging till I find the source of the problem.

[Cokym]

After few days of the valve adjustment the scoot is now starting normally. So I suppose it just took some time after the adjustment to kick in.

But now there is coming louder then usual ticking from valve section so I have to check that out still...

[JayAre]

Once the valves are set the effect would be immediate it shouldn't take time to take effect. When you adjust the valves the motor needs to be cold/ambient temp & the feeler gauge should move with between the valve stem & rocker arm with minimal resistance after the locknut is tight. If the motor is hot or even warm when the adjustment is done it could cause some noise/ticking. Did you put gas in it when it started to start easier? If possible use non-ethanol premium gas only. Ethanol causes problems with carbs.

[Cokym]

Valve adjustment was the last thing I did and by few days I meant that during that time I tried starting it couple of times and it kept doing it better and better. I was told elsewhere that if the valve clearance had been almost 0 it would get better by driving after adjustment. I did not add any gas and the gas that is in there is the second premium out there with 5% ethanol. It is almost impossible nowadays around here to find gas without some ethanol.

Anyway, I adjusted the intake valve 2 times now and the ticking sound has diminished.

[SUPER 9 MANN]

that means the first time was incorrect, well now shes running fine now and thats all that counts

[Cokym]

I haven't really used the kick start since may but noticed that if the engine is cold I can get the scoot to start with kick start after few kicks but if the engine is warm then I either can't get it to start with kick start or it takes a lot of tries and luck.

Also I have noticed that the scoot eats oil.  Switched to 20w-50 and it still eats oil but not at much...


I'll change the cylinder, piston and gaskets later in the summer and let you know if it helps.

[Andreeh00]

I have the same thing with my Agility rs 4t. Kick start wont do anything when the engine is warm or its warm outside, but in spring and fall when its cold Electric start does nothing, but i get the engine running with first kick. Seems like that's just a feature on Agility's... But as long the scooter starts and run's well it shouldn't be a big issue i guess.

[JayAre]

If your looking for a cylinder, piston, rings, & head I've got the parts I took off my wife's 2013 Agility 50 when I put the Big Bore in it. The bike had 13 miles on it when I BB it. $25+ shipping

[Cokym]

Cheers but I already got 72cc kit from china boys. I just haven't have time to install it.

I just can't believe that kick start not doing its job when weather is hot or engine is warm is normal. There has to be something wrong somewhere.

[JayAre]

Hard starting & oil use could be low compression you'd have to test to know for sure. Check out "Hard to start" by Jos, for some other possibilities. Also I posted 50-72cc if you want to see what I encountered with my piston, cylinder, & head install on the  wife's 13 Agility.