PLease tell me these scooters are not this slow.

[djb]

Hi all,

 A couple of days ago I entered the realm of scootering. I have had bikes all of my life, but usually the race replica style with a couple of naked's over the years. This scooter is a new world to me, especially the automatic transmission.

 I bought a 2006 People 250. It was primarily intended for my wife to use as a commuter, but i have to admit I was really wanting to get on it myself. She test rode it, liked it, and the deal was done.

 Well, when i took it out, it just wasn't right at all. It was just gutless! I am used to bigger bikes with more power, but for a 1st bike for my wife i got her a Ninja 250, and this was not even comparable. Something has to be wrong.

 I read through a few tests before i bought it that said it was quite a brisk scooter to ride, one of the best ones out there performance wise. This one we have won't go over 50 mph with me on it (190lbs) and that takes about 20 seconds to hit! It doesn't even sound like it's even trying to rev hard. It was supposed to have had a new belt and rollers just before i got it.

 Being mechanically competant, i got stuck into trying to find what could be wrong. I took the drive cover and pulley assemblies off. Belt and rollers were new and well within spec. Clutch was also within spec. There are still a couple of measurements i need to check that are in the manual that i have not got around to.

 Replaced the spark plug and fuel filter - verified there was no fuel restriction, checked the valves and adjusted (Thought i found my problem with a too small gap on the inlet side, but it didn't change anything when i rode it afterwards)

 With the engine cold i got 130PSI cylinder pressure, warm i got 180 PSI. What are your thoughts on this, the manual states the equivalent of 213PSI, and i'm not sure if thats a warm or cold reading? I would assume warm.

 The spark plug looks like it may be a tad on the lean side being a bit whiter than i would like.

 With the drive belt off, the engine will rev up high like i would expect it to, with the belt on with bike on center stand it just doesn't want to rev at all. When i'm riding, it just feels and sounds like i'm at half throttle. I have checked the carb to verify the butterfly is opening all the way.

 I would assume if it was a drive problem, the engine would still rev properly, and the drive would just slip and i would smell the belt? There is new gear oil in the diff and it spins freely. It's just weird that it just won't rev. I'm thinking maybe a carb problem or a weak spark box? 

 I'm running out of ideas and would appreciate any input you guys have regarding this problem. Maybe it's something simple that i'm just not seeing.

 Not really the introduction to scootering i was looking for, but it keeps me busy i suppose 

[axy]

It is not clear is your scooter slow because of some mechanical problem or you are expecting too much.

P250 has 20 hp, Ninja 250 has 30-35 hp. The difference is quite big.

Furthermore, People 250 should go from 0-60 mph in 11.5-12 secs.

I also had a number of bikes in my life from 50 to 750 cc and drove a number of bikes between 50 and 1400 cc.
People 250 (S) is quite competent scoot, I think, and its drawbacks are not related to lack of power but some other things (suspension and lack of build quality, to name few).

I read your post once again and this story about not revving with belt is quite strange... did you check the clutch (rear) and roller weights+plate (front)? Everything OK?
If it won't rev, and revs freely without belt, it should be something related to roller weights, their push-plate or that piece of cylindrical metal that goes inside towards the shaft.
What about those strange "V" shaped pieces of plastic or whatever that go on the side of the plate? Everything fine, nothing missing, broken or worn?

[TechGuy]

There is something seriously wrong here. My P250 will accelerate to 50 MPH VERY quickly and reaches a top speed (on flat ground, without a downhill) in excess of 80 MPH indicated.  I am considerably heavier than you are. My scoot is stock except for the change to Dr.Pulley sliders (23x18 21g) to replace the factory rollers.

I would look at the belt to confirm you have the factory belt and check to see that your rollers are correct. I know that when my sliders were installed incorrectly, I was limited to 60MPH. Light rollers would mean that the variator is not forcing the belt all the way out.  A short belt of skinny belt would limit your speed.

I see that you checked these things. Were the new parts OEM parts?  What was the length of  the belt and what were the dimensions of the rollers.   

[art]

  I would check to make sure one of your rollers in the veriater didn't get turned sidways when reasembling got to keep that pinched together when slidding it back on, The s200 pulls to 50mph real fast and tops around 65 indicated. I hear the 250 can hit 85mph. Good luck

[djb]

The belt is new and geuine. The part # matches what's listed as a replacement. As for the rollers, i would assume they were also the correct genuine ones as they were all bought at the same time. With not having worked on one of these before, i kind of dropped the ball and the roller/slider assembley was upside down in my hands and fell apart, so i can not confirm how they were positiond when installed. The cones where the belt runs seemed to be ok, but i haven't pulled the clutch apart to make sure that's all ok, just checked the lining depth.

 My thing with theis is the fact that under any kind of load at all it will not get up, even just the load of the drive freewheeling. I'm just stumped. i'm going to try to find some carb settings and take a look at that.

[art]

Here's some pic's. I think you got something wrong with the veriater. once assembled correctly you have to hold it in place as you slide it back into place,if not the rollers can turn sideways on you

[art]

next

[djb]

Here's some pic's. I think you got something wrong with the veriater. once assembled correctly you have to hold it in place as you slide it back into place,if not the rollers can turn sideways on you

Thanks for the pics.

The only thing i've noticed is that my rollers are pale yellow and not black. May be completely irrelevant, but just in case it could be something, i may as well mention it.

[jprestonian]

My OEM rollers were pale yellow, too... and well-worn when they were replaced with Dr Pulley slider weights, last month.
.

[art]

 The color was for another scoot just to give you an idea of how it go's

[djb]

OK, Happy Days...it's fixed!

 Firstly i need to give myself a kicking for going against first thoughts and spending hours looking at irrelevant things. Secondly, and more importantly, at least now i have a much better knowledge about the transmission and drive unit.

 It was a fuel problem. As soon as i got into the carb and saw that it was a diaphragm variable throat i knew straight away what the problem was. The Diaphragm seal where the cover goes over had not been installed correctly and was leaking air. I've seen this a thousand times on jetski's i've worked on and felt an instant feeling of embarrasment  What i spent hours taking apart and researching on here, was a simple 30 second fix.

 Now this is more like it! It is now great to use on the road, pulls great from a standstill and hit's 60 with ease. Couldn't really go over that here in the Northern Virginia beltway area, but i could tell if it were not for the traffic it would go more. Still getting used to that rear brake not being a clutch, but otherwise a great bike to be on in the traffic. I'll not miss the big manual gearbox bikes in the DC traffic that's for sure.

 Thanks for the input, always appreciated.

[art]

 Cool!  Now you know your cvt and the rest is a breeze.   

[axy]

My OEM rollers were pale yellow, too... and well-worn when they were replaced with Dr Pulley slider weights, last month.
.

After how many kms you changed the rollers?
I have just turned 11K km yesterday...

[jprestonian]

Roller change: ~17,000km.
.

[TechGuy]

I changed my first set and a factory belt at about 21,000km.  I added used sliders then (installed them wrong) fixed them and now I am at 32,000 km. I replaced the second belt after it disintegrated at 30,800km and I think the sliders are in backwards.

I have new sliders to replace the damaged ones.  Just waiting for the right time to open her up.