Author Topic: AK550 coolant flush  (Read 1644 times)

jermwars

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AK550 coolant flush
« on: March 03, 2022, 09:34:36 PM »
Swapped out the coolant in the AK today and AFTER i got all the plastic put back on it dawned on me that there's no need to take anything off...AT ALL.

The radiator cap it JUST accessible from the underneath. Cant really see it, but you can reach it and remove it. Then just a funnel and length of hose to refill.

SUPER easy job. Unless you are a dimwit like myself and pull off a bunch of plastic unnecessarily.

Next time ill know.

Also blew out the CVT air filter...it had been about 5000 miles since i blew it out last and there was only a PUFF of dust and a few dog hairs in it this time. I can barely imagine an environment where that thing would actually need cleaned out even every 10k miles...Much less 3,000. Guess its worth throwing eyes on it occasionally more than anything. Same for the engine air filter. Almost spotless. Changed it anyway but im saving all the used ones and will blow them out and re-use them once the bikes no longer under warranty.

Putting off the brake fluid change for now. Simply cant think of any reason to swap it out already. Its practically brand new.
22' KymCo AK550
07' Yamaha Majesty YP400

Stig / Major Tom

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2022, 10:47:25 PM »
You swapped out the coolant on a 2022 scooter?!!

No photos with the plastic off to share with your fellow 550 owners?
Stig
« Last Edit: March 03, 2022, 10:50:24 PM by Stig / Major Tom »
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jermwars

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2022, 11:10:42 PM »
You swapped out the coolant on a 2022 scooter?!!

No photos with the plastic off to share with your fellow 550 owners?
Stig

That was extremely inconsiderate of me to not take pictures.

I also should have taken pictures because i have a little plastic fastener left over and its itching pretty bad trying to remember where i got it from. Cant find a spot for it so it must be buried. Pretty sure its not gonna break any hearts.

Im with ya about the coolant...The schedule is 6,000 or 6 months and im at 9,500 miles and approaching 6 months soon enough so I decided to do it while I was doing the oil and stuff...seems absurdly pro-active to me, but im sure there must be good enough reasons.

Its due for a brake fluid change already too and i even bought some fluid and a pump but i just cant bring myself to do it yet. Just refuse to believe its necessary already
22' KymCo AK550
07' Yamaha Majesty YP400

Stig / Major Tom

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2022, 11:28:01 PM »
Apologies I had no idea that scooter required a coolant change at only 6,000 miles instead of every couple of years!!

I do love my air-cooled!
Stig
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jermwars

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #4 on: March 03, 2022, 11:35:53 PM »
Apologies I had no idea that scooter required a coolant change at only 6,000 miles instead of every couple of years!!

I do love my air-cooled!
Stig

I wouldnt have believed it if i'd told me either.
22' KymCo AK550
07' Yamaha Majesty YP400

rjs987

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2022, 03:07:34 AM »
I usually ride just over 7,000 miles per year on average but really don't see a need to replace the coolant that often. Brake fluid either. I do have the manual pump and have replaced brake fluid using it on a few of my bikes... but at a much longer interval. Same coolant and brake fluid used so don't really see the difference about replacing it so soon on this bike vs my other bikes (CTX1300 and Burgman 650).

Now, the CVT belt is a different matter. While I've never needed to replace that in my Burgman (supposedly a lifetime belt... yeah, right) I don't plan on pushing it on my AK for that item. I sometimes ride out far enough that I wouldn't want to end up calling for a tow on a trailer because it broke when I least expected it. So I will likely be replacing that every 2 years, at least until I get a really good feel for how it wears.

On the air filter: I do have a spare that I bought when I bought my AK. That was something that would not get old if it sat on the shelf for a few years (12,000 miles or 24 months). I haven't yet looked real close at it but would not be surprised it is made of similar filter material as my Burgman 650 air filter is made of. That one was a woven fiber filter element, not paper. Many Burgman owners have found they can wash those filters out and re-use them. I would blow it out first and then place the filter in a bath of water and dish soap and let it soak for a day. Then I would take an old tooth brush and brush out the stubborn grit that was in the folds of the filter... gently... and then let it air dry on the shelf waiting for the next change interval to use it again. I had 2 filters that I would swap out this way. Never really found them to be all that dirty so cleaning one was easy. Thinking if the AK air filter element is the same stuff I may do that for the AK as well.

Maybe this will be the year I change the coolant in my wife's 2003 Honda Metropolitan. That hasn't been done since she bought it in 2005!  :o But that thing's a tank and just keeps going. Only needs gas and once in a while a new battery (every 5-6 years).
/bob
2022 Kymco AK 550 Super Touring Extreme in Matte Deep Blue
RETIRED - US Navy and Air National Guard and civilian career

jermwars

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2022, 04:06:07 AM »
I haven't yet looked real close at it but would not be surprised it is made of similar filter material as my Burgman 650 air filter is made of. That one was a woven fiber filter element, not paper.

Pretty sure its not wetable :(

DNA makes something though that looks pretty neat...have you looked at it?
Looks something like what you mentioned...

"This is an extremely important part of the DNA filter. As soon as the DNA Oil is added to the cotton media, the cotton is "static charged" and transformed into an unbeatable filtering material! To achieve this fantastic result we have developed a unique air filter oil formula."

https://www.e-dnafilters.com/product/Motorcycle-Filters/Kymco/DNA-1402/P-KY5SC18-01/Kymco-AK550-Euro-4-(17-20)-DNA-Air-Filter-P-KY5SC18-01
« Last Edit: March 04, 2022, 04:08:03 AM by jermwars »
22' KymCo AK550
07' Yamaha Majesty YP400

jermwars

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2022, 04:37:37 AM »

Now, the CVT belt is a different matter. While I've never needed to replace that in my Burgman (supposedly a lifetime belt... yeah, right) I don't plan on pushing it on my AK for that item. I sometimes ride out far enough that I wouldn't want to end up calling for a tow on a trailer because it broke when I least expected it. So I will likely be replacing that every 2 years, at least until I get a really good feel for how it wears.


Other that the scenario you talked about above, how bad would you think a CVT belt failure could be? And do you think miles mean as much as time if we're only concerning catastrophic failure and ignoring wear?

Because im thinking that belt can survive at LEAST a year without exploding on me...even if that means twice the scheduled mileage. Its a beast of a belt
22' KymCo AK550
07' Yamaha Majesty YP400

Stig / Major Tom

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2022, 10:05:01 AM »
Got to say I don't understand guys who buy the expensive Kymco Mothership and then start looking for ways to ignore the recommended service intervals of an important piece of the drivetrain!
It's a beefy belt....hauling a powerful and beefy scooter.
When you buy any (expensive or not) vehicle - that implies you've read and agree to deal with its future running costs.
Surely you guys explored the cost of parts and service intervals before purchasing?
Stig
 
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rjs987

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2022, 03:51:36 PM »
Yes I did explore costs of ongoing maintenance parts and such. I also pay attention to "normal" maintenance intervals for many different bikes with the same equipment.
I hope we are not talking about the final drive belt that goes to the rear wheel (the one you can see without removing any case covers that is called the "Timing Belt" in the service schedule). That one should last a really long time and the service schedule doesn't say anything about when to replace other than to show in the owner manual what to look for to see when replacement is recommended. I do intend to follow the maintenance schedule while the bike is under warranty. And after that I'll take note of the condition of any parts or fluids replaced to gauge if I can resort to a slightly longer interval or keep to the indicated schedule. As one example: my CTX1300 had a valve clearance check scheduled at every 16,000 miles. Same bullet proof engine as in the ST1300 since 2002 and experience of many ST owners, and CTX owners, indicated that there is nearly a 99% chance that valves will not need even minor adjusting until somewhere between 60,000-90,000 miles at least.


I also noted during my own research how the maintenance schedule for new bikes tends to be VERY conservative and schedule things a lot sooner than really needed just out of caution until some time passes with the bike "out in the world" and more accurate scheduling of maintenance for many parts can be determined. Example, the oil and oil filter change interval in the earlier models of the AK were scheduled twice as often as shown in my current manual as were a few other maintenance items, but current schedule shows a much more normal interval. Brake fluid usually has a built in indicator that it is in need of replacing, it changes color. But if the color is same as new than likely it is fine for a little while longer. Coolant is different since color really doesn't change much, but specific gravity does so that would have to be measured (I have the tool for that).


A CVT belt failure in my Burgman 650 would have required dropping the engine out of the frame just to get at the CVT and then a major overhaul of the CVT with a new expensive belt (double or triple the price of the CVT belt for almost any other scooter with a CVT) and several gears and possibly a bearing or two needing to be replaced. A CVT belt fail in the AK would likely be no different than in most other scooters with a CVT... just a belt replacement and cleaning up in the CVT case and not really likely much else other than to verify the condition of plates and pulleys and rollers/sliders. No need to drop the engine out of the bike or replace other major parts.


Do you think you'll be riding more than 12,000 miles in a year? The maintenance schedule puts CVT belt replacement at 2 years or 12,000 miles. I look at indicated limits in the schedule to mean which ever comes first. So if you get to 12,000 miles before 2 years is up then go with that, if you go 2 years before you get 12,000 miles then go with that. I've regularly read about owners of many other scooters who measure the CVT belt to determine wear and if within limits given in the manuals they leave it for a while longer.


BTW- anyone know the price of the CVT belt? or the Timing/final drive belt?
I found these belts available on TBS web site for what looked like reasonable pricing but haven't priced from any other source yet.
https://taiwanbigscootershop.com/collections/ak550
They have many farkles but also many service parts. The official air filter there is a better price than what I paid my dealer for one. Although shipping would make it about the same or slightly more depending how many items I order at one time.
/bob
2022 Kymco AK 550 Super Touring Extreme in Matte Deep Blue
RETIRED - US Navy and Air National Guard and civilian career

Stig / Major Tom

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2022, 05:56:23 PM »
I've read on the Burgman forum that when the 650 belt wears out - there is something involved there which makes some owners choose to sell the bike on, rather than attempt a repair.
By all accounts a great scooter - but if you're not a top-notch mechanic could be expensive to own long term.
Still, guys loved them.
Wonder if Suzuki will bring back something to replace them?

Stig
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rjs987

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #11 on: March 04, 2022, 06:41:52 PM »
I've read on the Burgman forum that when the 650 belt wears out - there is something involved there which makes some owners choose to sell the bike on, rather than attempt a repair.
By all accounts a great scooter - but if you're not a top-notch mechanic could be expensive to own long term.
Still, guys loved them.
Wonder if Suzuki will bring back something to replace them?

Stig


Yep, the problem is so rare it really isn't much of a problem. But when it does happen it is a major repair. I've read estimates of just over $1500 if the rider does it themselves to somewhere over $2500-$3500 if the dealer does it. The problem shows up most in older Burgman 650 scooters and the value of those at that time is really close to the cost of repair. So those owners would have to decide how badly they wanted to keep their Burgman 650. Of course, as you know, those who have had the problem speak out loudly about it so even though the CVT failure really only happens on about 5% at most of all Burgman 650 scooters on the road I'd say maybe 60% of posts about this issue are from those who experienced it so it sounds much more prevalent than it really is. Usually the real problem is caused by a cheaper nylon gear that shatters and bits get snagged under the belt causing the belt to then fail. Other times the bearing on the drive shaft fails and bits of that will get caught under the belt. So the belt itself really doesn't cause the issue but some other part. Rarely does the belt itself ever fail. I was aware of the potential of this problem with my 2013 Burgman 650 but wasn't really concerned that I would ever see it so I just kept riding on long trips to anywhere.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2022, 06:43:38 PM by rjs987 »
/bob
2022 Kymco AK 550 Super Touring Extreme in Matte Deep Blue
RETIRED - US Navy and Air National Guard and civilian career

Stig / Major Tom

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2022, 12:03:19 AM »

Yep, the problem is so rare it really isn't much of a problem. But when it does happen it is a major repair. I've read estimates of just over $1500 if the rider does it themselves to somewhere over $2500-$3500 if the dealer does it. The problem shows up most in older Burgman 650 scooters and the value of those at that time is really close to the cost of repair. So those owners would have to decide how badly they wanted to keep their Burgman 650. Of course, as you know, those who have had the problem speak out loudly about it so even though the CVT failure really only happens on about 5% at most of all Burgman 650 scooters on the road I'd say maybe 60% of posts about this issue are from those who experienced it so it sounds much more prevalent than it really is. Usually the real problem is caused by a cheaper nylon gear that shatters and bits get snagged under the belt causing the belt to then fail. Other times the bearing on the drive shaft fails and bits of that will get caught under the belt. So the belt itself really doesn't cause the issue but some other part. Rarely does the belt itself ever fail. I was aware of the potential of this problem with my 2013 Burgman 650 but wasn't really concerned that I would ever see it so I just kept riding on long trips to anywhere.

And wasn't there a guy in Poland who sold some kind of special bolt that keep it from sounding like a diesel truck idling?
When I buy had my 400 Burgman I'd read all about the 650, and rarely understand much of it.
You'd make a good ambassador for the 650....
5% issues would be acceptable for any vehicle...'cept my plane!
Stig
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rjs987

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Re: AK550 coolant flush
« Reply #13 on: March 05, 2022, 01:09:52 AM »

And wasn't there a guy in Poland who sold some kind of special bolt that keep it from sounding like a diesel truck idling?
When I buy had my 400 Burgman I'd read all about the 650, and rarely understand much of it.
You'd make a good ambassador for the 650....
5% issues would be acceptable for any vehicle...'cept my plane!
Stig


WHAT!? you won't fly your plane with a 5% chance of falling out of the sky???
OK, I guess I can accept that.


Yea, that diesel fix was for the early versions of the Burgman 650. But there is a "stopper bolt" that needs inspecting for wear that some think could prevent CVT issues. It's a cheap replacement part that can have major cost implications if that is true. That bolt is for stopping the variator from opening too far. Needed since the Burgman 650 CVT variator is electrically operated with a small electric motor rather than mechanically operated with rollers or sliders. That stopper bolt and the diesel fix are slightly different things, but related.


And I still do attempt to assist others with their Burgman 650 when I can. And also on their CTX1300 bikes as well, and not because I'm a moderator on that forum.
/bob
2022 Kymco AK 550 Super Touring Extreme in Matte Deep Blue
RETIRED - US Navy and Air National Guard and civilian career

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