Different Size Variator

[sidthesloth]

G'Day All, I bought a race variator from an ebay seller and when I tried to fit it, it would not fit (it was jamming on the crankcase). Does anyone know if Kymco changed the crankcase or do I have an odd situation. I have included a photo of the two variators so you can see the difference.

[Shaka]

It's hard to really tell how much bigger it is from the pic.  Is it hitting around the edges or bottoming against the back?  I'm not sure if they changed crankcase size, but I doubt it.  I hate to say it, but that is really the risk you take buying stuff on ebay.  The other problem you run into is compatibility between different parts from different manufacturers.  With cvt parts, you may end up with different angles pulley faces or differences between variator and clutch parts which will lead to a need for a different belt, or premature/excessive belt wear.  I would definitely recommend using all cvt parts from the same manufacturer and using their recommended belt for your application.  I'm a big fan of Malossi parts personally!  I don't really think their cvt parts can be beat!  They are a bit pricey, but that's the price you have to pay for stuff that just plain works!  I would try and contact the ebay seller and see what they have to say.  Possibly see if you can return the variator.  Then check out http://www.malossiusaonline.com.

[sidthesloth]

G'Day shaka, thanks for the reply, my existing variator is 83.5mm and the new one is 87.6mm, if you look at the photo you will see a thin line around the back edge where it was touching on the crankcase. I know buying from ebay does have it's risks but as long as you are prepared to accept this I think you can get some good buys, (and possibly some bad ones as well). I think in this case I will have to try to save some dough and try Malossi. It is all good fun and learning as you go, by the way, the seller has offered a refund, so no dramas there. Just curiousl, does your variator look like the one on the bottom of the photo? the rollers in mine were 15.5mm and the book says should be 13. maybe I have a freak?

[zombie]

Hey Sid, With an over range var you HAVE to do some minor modding of the case. Mind you not all vars. will fit all cases but if it is hitting one of the webs, you can use a die grinder to remove some material, or even a dremel tool will do. You will only need 1mm clearance, 

[sidthesloth]

Hi zombie, I didnt want to grind the casing as I dont know how thick it is. could lead to a whole lot of trouble.

[Shaka]

Sid, My stock variator looks almost exactly the same as yours.  I see the small line you were talking about where it was hitting.  It looks like the new one is just not machined down around the inside edge like the stock one is.  Are those measurements you gave for the inside, or the outside face?  What is the difference on the inside where it is hitting?  From my understanding you can grind quite a bit off the inside of the case without too much worry.  The larger variator will also give you a higher top speed, so it may be worthwhile!  You may need a slightly longer belt to be able to run all the way to the top though.  I understand if you don't want to do any grinding, I would be hesitant myself!  I personally just went with a Malossi Multivar and belt.  The Multivar also comes with the white contra spring.  If you would like I can look for the correct part # for you.  I'm not exactly sure how much one costs, i got an insane deal on mine!

[zombie]

I understand what you're saying!. My thought is, If it's only webs that need finishing then I would HAVE to go for it. Already got the part, and all... Shaka's right about committing to a proven set up at least until you get to know what you need. Can you give us a link to what you have? It may help all the way along the road. (pun)

[sidthesloth]

G'day, the variator itself is no bigger, it just doesn't taper at the back like the original one. It touches on the crankcase by the starter motor lay shaft. Yeah, if it was only webs I would grind it, but I think it best to wait and see what I can get a bit further down the road. I do have a cylinder kit coming, just a mater of being patient.

[sidthesloth]

Well, I bit the bullet and did the grind this morning. The new variator is now on and I thought, why didn't I do this earlier. There wasn't much to grind of, just a shave off the surface really. I dont know that it is much faster but power delivery is so much smoother that it feels like it may be a little faster, (wishfull thinking?). Well worth the effort, which was minimal any way. I guess I was worried about grinding the case.

[zombie]

There ya go mate...No worries! Some of the tuning process may seem scary at first, but as you tackle tougher jobs, the fear just vanishes. It just makes me feel all warm inside...

[sidthesloth]

Yeah, once done there is no looking back.:-)

[sidthesloth]

G'Day, I finally got to post the link for the variator, it is
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370358745354&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT I hope that works. I have ordered some clutch fly springs that are apparently rated at 1.5k, Iam assuming that is the expected engagement speed, could anyone tell me the original setting for this with the zx50 please. As the weights are easier to change than the torque spring I will try some 7 gram rollers (the ones with the variator are 8.5).

[zombie]

I think the "k" rating refers to the rpm's at the clutch, and not at the engine. All these shops have different ratings, but I found the mid size springs from most of them to work the best. I also have 5.5gr Malossi rollers in my set up. I tried 7's when I first set this scoot up, and did not get into the power band on the pipe. The whole idea of the rollers is to tune to the desired running rpm's. I believe I top out around 11'500-12'000. 3'500 is where i BARELY roll, and 7-8'000 is where the clutch really locks up. Bad for fuel economy, but great for riding. With your kit being slightly larger I think 6ish would get you on it. But it all depends on where your kit makes it's peak power. Mine comes in around 9'000, I couldn't guess yours. The rollers will be trial, and error just like the jets. The factory springs I assume come in around 800 at the clutch.

[sidthesloth]

Thanks zombie, I realise it is the clutch speed given that the idle speed is 2000. the rollers are 8.5, trying 7 will give me a bit of an idea. Hopefully it will be a bit more fun than the jet tuning. I think the jet is pretty close now, I raised the needle to the second notch the other day and it seems pretty good. Last night I went through all my plugs and found  one that lines up pretty close and guess what, that detonation noise is completely gone but unfortunately I think the plug is sus as it is not as smooth running at speed. I do have another one I put an aluminium washer on that also comes in pretty close. The missus rode the scooter the other day and reckons "we have turned a mild mannered scooter into a blood thirsty beast". She likes it.
(edited due to bad spelling, damn those mobile phones).

[zombie]

That's super cool to hear dude! I think w/ a little off the head you will be amazed at the difference. Indexing the plug put the flame front in the right direction, and the shave will boost the charge from that. Be aware the pre ign is JUST AROUND THE CORNER until you do the head. I'm real happy to hear the mrs. likes it. Mine hated me fooling w/ the scoots. That's why (partly) she's not here, and the scooters are! The roller tuning is MUCH easier than jetting because there are NO variables. No indexing, or needle hight, just straight up results. You will have extra rollers when you are done, but I found w/ the good results you are getting others around you will start getting into scootin' and you will have a head start on stock for setting them up. That's no joke. I have to order parts for myself to replace what I sell to some of the OLD DUDES riding their Puch's, and Vespa's around town. If you get a little bored on nite maybe you could post up a little recipe of the set-up, and results. Just to sorta consolidate all the facts so it is easy to follow for someone else looking to build a "Blood Thirsty Beast" Or is that Fuel Thirsty. Stock I did almost 50miles to a tank. Now I'm under 20. I sure do wish all us zx'ers were local. Imagine the Hell that could be raised...