Electrical problems with my GV 250

[Agent Bob]

With no wiring diagram it's hard to figure. Usually you think of a switch applying voltage to somewhere, but the starter switch may be applying ground to the starter relay instead, so if that wire were being grounded somewhere  else like the frame, that would do it.

[wordslinger]

..the starter motor goes to ground there...the switch supplies voltage to the relay, which allows voltage to pass thru it's contacts to the starter...

..there is a wiring diagram in the service manual...


peace

[mudshark]

I've experienced similar problem with People S 250.  Replaced starter relay 3 weeks ago as relay appeared to be stuck open and wouldn't start.  Problem seemed solved.  Now starter won't stop as it appears new relay is stuck closed.  Will check for worn wires as well as contacts on starter button.  Battery is new.  The starter relays have cost about $50 with shipping.  I read on the forum that a standard Bosch 30 amp automotive relay could be used in place of the OEM part as long as the OEM connectors were soldered into place.  That would sure make experimenting less expensive.  Thanks for your thoughts.

Have now searched for worn wires and checked starter button.  Don't see any problems.  Scoot starts when battery connected and starter button pressed, but starter continues to run after engine switch turned off.  Any thoughts on what might cause two relays to stick in different positions?  Any help on this would be appreciated.  Thanks.

[art]

Could be a plan. wondering how long my s200 starter is going to last. Got a local shop that will let me look at there info and mitsubshi happens to cross allot with belts and such.  My starter sounds a little wound too tight,but continues to work.(don't sound just right). Been hard to get any straight info from kymco even.

[wordslinger]

..these 4-strokes wear hard on the starter...

..i'm running a "hybrid" kymco/marshin that i assembled...(not an easy task)

..it's beginning to drag and whine some already...

..put it on my 2-stroke and it sings like a bird...

[Al Grande]

Update on my electrical (starter) problems with my worthless GV 250. I still have the problem with the starter staying on after I start up the GV. It's usually once every few weeks this happens, but after I get my scoot home, I disconnect the battery, and it shuts off the engine. The next day, I reconnect the battery, and all is well. The GV starts up without a problem and shuts off normally.

Last week (8/17/10) I rode the GV to the mechanic just to have them check it out. I told them that once the starter stays on, I disconnect the battery, leave it alone for the night, and the next morning everything is cool.

They check it out and they can't figure out why it's doing this. They placed an order for a brand new starter (the whole starter, not just the solenoid). They believe the starter assembly is the culprit, though they're not sure. It's still under warranty, so, I'm letting them do it.

Anyway, today, in the 108 degree heat, I left work, started up my GV, and BAM, the starter stays ON. Screw it I thought, and rode my scoot home. Weird thing, the extra whurrling sound of the starter staying ON, stops and the scooter is running normally.

I get home shut off the GV, and restart it without a hitch. It's OK, for now.

I don't get it. The starter stays ON, then after riding it a couple of blocks, the starter shuts off normal - without sticking.

I'm still saving up money to buy a new scooter. Hopefully, by November, I'll be riding a new scooter. No more Kymco!
   

[Hoolander2]

Sorry to hear there's still this problem.  Glad the dealer is gonna step up, though. 

I'm really sorry this seems to be a problem with GVs in general because I've been thinking when I get older and need to downsize I would go with the GV.  I really like it's styling and have heard many good things about it . . . as well as the bad now. 

[TechGuy]

Al,

Which shop are you taking your scoot to?  I would also wonder why the bike is limited to the mid 60's.

I am local to Sacramento.  PM me and we can discuss your options.

My experience is that Kymcos are very reliable bikes.  The GV, B&W and P250 (both styles) all use just about the motor and CVT. Mine will haul my 2-up sized butt to 80 MPH any time I care for it to.

[wordslinger]

...warranty...

..i'm sorry, but at the least, if they just can't seem to figure it out, they can certainly replace all the components, even wiring that's in the circuit....

..itsa no-brainer to me...

..you should push your shop to get this right...


peace

[wordslinger]

..i've read back through the posts, and i didn't see where they replaced the $10.00 micro-switch in the start pushbutton...

..can you get to the connector at the starter motor fairly easily??

..if you can, you could try unplugging it the next time this happens, as it's happening...

..if the starter motor stops, then you know there is voltage being supplied to the starter motor when it should not be...

..one should then be able to trace, using a digital voltmeter and a wiring schematic, the source of the errant voltage...

..it's a process of elimination that i do on a regular basis, troubleshooting electrical issues on the equipment where i work...any good shop mechanic should be able to trace it back...

[sidthesloth]

Sounds like a dodgy relay, but, is it a whole batch they are getting rid of? I would be trying a non genuine relay, just out of curiosity, if that fixes it then would mount a relay block and use it permanently.

[Agent Bob]

I worked as an electronics technician for over 30 yrs. before retiring, and have seen relay contacts weld shut. This happens mostly in high current situations where current is being applied to an inductive load like a motor. When the contacts try to open, the electric field of the motor collapses and tries to maintain current, causing an arc in the contacts. I suspect the relays are  marginal by design, or they just happened to manufacture a bad batch. A capacitor across the contacts would give the current spike somewhere to go, like a condenser used to do in the old points ignition systems which I remember fondly. LOL

[wordslinger]

A capacitor across the contacts would give the current spike somewhere to go

..yes it would...

[Agent Bob]

Dammit, I can't stop thinking about this problem. Intermittents are the most challenging but the most rewarding when fixed. I was looking at the wiring diagram of the start circuit of my S200 and it's pretty basic, so I think it's fair to assume it applies to most Kymcos. The relay is energized when 12v is applied via the ignition switch and either stop switch. The cicuit is completed when ground is applied to the other side of the relay via the start switch. What I would do is make a poor man's voltmeter. Get a 12v bulb and socket. Make the wires longer. Tape the bulb where you can se it when riding. Bare the wires on the other end and hook into the relay wiring. You could probably poke the bare ends into the connector somehow. Tape it all up. When you start the scoot the light will go on and go out when you release the start button. Ride normally and if your starter motor goes nuts, check your light. If it's off your relay is welded shut. If it's on, your relay is energized. Since the starter circuit is completed by ground being applied to the relay, you may have a starter wire pinched  to the frame somewhere. It happens. Might be at the steering head from the wear of steering.

[wordslinger]

..you've hit the nail on the head, Agent Bob!!!