Should a new Downtown 350i consume/burn oil?

[Forbes1964]

Excellent point! It is exactly, EXACTLY the point in nearly ALL the warranty issues such as Jordan Kaptan's problem in Greece. His new 2018 People S 150 ABS has an engine start problem and an unexplained engine failure problem. The dealer has been stringing him along for months. The importer is now bringing up the number of miles on the bike as a disqualifier for warranty. Kymco global only knows what the dealer and the importer tells them so they propose sending a new ECU for installation at the end of May! Boils down to the dealer tech is the "expert" and the customer is at the mercy of a man who just can't be bothered.

Maybe Kymco is terrible and different than any car company. But manufacturers have procedures in place that don’t simply take a dealer at his word. They ask us for documentation. They want repeat customers. And they know that unhappy customers TALK and don’t buy their products again. If a customer goes over our heads, they make us go through a process, so we can DOCUMENT to the customer that there is or is not a problem.


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[Vision4]

I don't know if this is the case with your bike, but one person earlier in this thread brought up the idea that manufacturers use the same dipstick for multiple models, and that "full" for your machine may or may not read as full on the dipstick. I just wanted to circle back to this because on my UXV 450i, when I received it brand new from the dealer about six weeks ago, the oil level on the dipstick was right in the middle of the acceptable range on the dipstick - not low, not high.

This past weekend, I did the first oil change. After refilling the engine with the amount of oil recommended in the owner's manual (2.5 quarts), guess where the oil level is on the dipstick? That's right; right in the middle of the run range. So, I would not see any reason to "top it off" by adding a little more oil, and I wonder if the engine would consume oil if I did until it returned to the current level.

At any rate, just thought I would share this, because I think the suggestion someone else gave regarding draining the oil, filling to exact manual specs and then monitoring is a good one. You may have already done that, but perhaps this will be helpful for someone else down the line. At any rate, I wish you the best of luck with your machine and hope you get your problem resolved soon.

Thank you for that suggestion!

We did talk about that earlier on this thread. I said i don't really think that that's the case because, first of all, i did check the oil level a couple of times before the first service and it was perfectly fixed on the higher level on the dipstick.

Second of all, the oil level on the dipstick went down almost all the way, so it was well below the halfpoint. And i don't find it likely that that's normal because how would i know then if the oil pressure is dangerously low? there would be no way to tell. other then when the oil/engine light goes on i guess. doesn't seem reasonable anyway.

Stig - I did check the manual of course, and it says there that the dipstick should "rest" on the lip without any screwing.

So i really don't think that the way i'm checking oil, or the way in which the oil pressure shows on the dipstick are the issues here.

KymcoRockr - Well, right know i'm really just hoping for any response from them. Which in itself is highly unlikely as i understand.

If they decide to stand behind the dealer, and call that "natural consumption", fine. They'll at least give me a certain limit for the consumption, and that would be a closer to this story.
if they decide to be honest, and tell me i'm right, all the better.

But even though i really hope i get a response, i don't believe i will.

[Forbes1964]

Thank you for that suggestion!

We did talk about that earlier on this thread. I said i don't really think that that's the case because, first of all, i did check the oil level a couple of times before the first service and it was perfectly fixed on the higher level on the dipstick.

Second of all, the oil level on the dipstick went down almost all the way, so it was well below the halfpoint. And i don't find it likely that that's normal because how would i know then if the oil pressure is dangerously low? there would be no way to tell. other then when the oil/engine light goes on i guess. doesn't seem reasonable anyway.

Stig - I did check the manual of course, and it says there that the dipstick should "rest" on the lip without any screwing.

So i really don't think that the way i'm checking oil, or the way in which the oil pressure shows on the dipstick are the issues here.

KymcoRockr - Well, right know i'm really just hoping for any response from them. Which in itself is highly unlikely as i understand.

If they decide to stand behind the dealer, and call that "natural consumption", fine. They'll at least give me a certain limit for the consumption, and that would be a closer to this story.
if they decide to be honest, and tell me i'm right, all the better.

But even though i really hope i get a response, i don't believe i will.

The key to all of this is that the consumption did not start until the oil change. As I suggested earlier, I believe that’s the key to the entire issue. I wouldn’t mention ANYTHING to either Kymco or the dealer again until I changed the oil with EXACTLY what they recommend for your operating conditions  , drive it normally and see what happens.

Nothing changed between the first oil change and now except the oil. Dump it and start over before making even one more move. Before one more ounce of worry, before getting upset in the least at Kymco. It’s even possible that the dealer himself believes that the consumption will level off and is an aberration. But he won’t commit to saying that. He likely believes that you’ll be pleasantly surprised as the engine breaks in further. Some engines simply take longer than others. That’s all. I may be wrong. But I think we both hope I’m not. [emoji23][emoji1479]


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[CROSSBOLT]

Maybe Kymco is terrible and different than any car company. But manufacturers have procedures in place that don’t simply take a dealer at his word. They ask us for documentation. They want repeat customers. And they know that unhappy customers TALK and don’t buy their products again. If a customer goes over our heads, they make us go through a process, so we can DOCUMENT to the customer that there is or is not a problem.


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Forbes, I love you as a good brother should and trust you as your word is sound like spiritual law. You are experienced with Ford and you have related details about their process that I was unaware. It sounds earnest and professional as it should be. I think Kymco is great as a manufacturer but their marketing and tech support are mysteries beyond common sense. Personally, I think they care not beyond the sale unlike you have described. I have even heard encouraging stories about GM auto tech services this week-end! I do think Kymco is eager to  throw warranty parts until a problem goes away and this works if a component fails. But is ineffective if the problem is in the wiring or its connectors. Then old fashioned detective work is needed and NONE of the scooter techs are qualified to bring you coffee! Let alone track a cable fault!

[scooterfan]

........................But manufacturers have procedures in place that don’t simply take a dealer at his word. They ask us for documentation. They want repeat customers. And they know that unhappy customers TALK and don’t buy their products again. If a customer goes over our heads, they make us go through a process, so we can DOCUMENT to the customer that there is or is not a problem.


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This might be applicable to Ford in the USA, but in South Africa Ford quite recently hit the brand's name with a plank by selling cars which caught fire due to overheating problems. These car's have never been tested properly, and at least one owner has burnt to death due to overheating problems.
Ford initially denied having problems with these cars, but eventually recalled 4556 of these cars to change some components which caused problems:

https://www.wheels24.co.za/News/Industry_News/owners-of-other-ford-models-join-complaints-over-burning-vehicles-20170119

As far as I know some court cases against Ford are still pending in South Africa.

[Forbes1964]

This might be applicable to Ford in the USA, but in South Africa Ford quite recently hit the brand's name with a plank by selling cars which caught fire due to overheating problems. These car's have never been tested properly, and at least one owner has burnt to death due to overheating problems.
Ford initially denied having problems with these cars, but eventually recalled 4556 of these cars to change some components which caused problems:

https://www.wheels24.co.za/News/Industry_News/owners-of-other-ford-models-join-complaints-over-burning-vehicles-20170119

As far as I know some court cases against Ford are still pending in South Africa.

We have the same recall. Safety Recalls fall into a different category. Before the recall, Ford had us to replace the entire engine when they overheated in that particular vehicle instead or repairing them. For the recall, they had us to alter the cooling system so it would purge trapped air better, add a coolant level sensor, and reprogram the engine so it would enter the engine protection strategy at a lower temperature. They also had us to closely inspect the engine for coolant leaks. The problem occurred in the event of a cracked head leaking coolant onto the turbo. (Antifreeze is flammable at super high temps). I agree, they SHOULD have performed the fix as soon as they discovered the problem instead of initially denying it.


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[KymcoRockr]

Second of all, the oil level on the dipstick went down almost all the way, so it was well below the halfpoint. And i don't find it likely that that's normal because how would i know then if the oil pressure is dangerously low? there would be no way to tell. other then when the oil/engine light goes on i guess. doesn't seem reasonable anyway.

Without knowing if it's normal, it's hard to say if it's normal or not. But by draining the oil and filling it with the right amount, you will know how things are, and not think about how things might be. You would have to lose a lot more oil before the oil pressure was dangerously low. You wouldn't see it on the dipstick at all.

[Forbes1964]

Without knowing if it's normal, it's hard to say if it's normal or not. But by draining the oil and filling it with the right amount, you will know how things are, and not think about how things might be. You would have to lose a lot more oil before the oil pressure was dangerously low. You wouldn't see it on the dipstick at all.

Exactly. I say the sooner the better in order to know for certain ASAP


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