Author Topic: Instrument weirdness  (Read 2073 times)

Lord Faversham

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Instrument weirdness
« on: June 04, 2019, 07:19:26 PM »
Greetings all.

First post from an excited new Xciting 500i owner which I picked up today. (Well, new to me but the scoot itself is not new - its an 08 model).  I bravely (stupidly?) rode it 100 miles back to Farkem Hall after picking it up, and apart from a bit of popping and banging on the overrun caused by (I believe) an over rich mixture as a result of a rusty and leaky exhaust with no baffles, it went very well. It certainly pulls well from rest and reaches 60 pretty quickly. I also saw a smidge  ;) over an indicated 75mph with bags in reserve so the engine seems good although there is a rather unpleasant occasional misfire at very high sustained revs (over 8K) which I suspect is due to it running rich. All this I aim to sort out in the fullness of time back at Farkem Hall as these are tuning matters.  (I'll have a good look at the plug condition to assess the mixture for example).

More frustratingly, there is a bit of an issue with the instrument panel it seems (apparently not uncommon from the number of posts in the forum) whereby not only is the odometer/clock display illegible (due to almost totally faded pixels), it fades further to nothing at all over time, and the oil service light won't go out despite suitable ministration of pointy objects on the mode switch (after the rubber bung has been removed to ensure accuracy).

I first suspected an iffy battery or a dodgy stator however, the battery at rest without the engine running was showing 13V and with the engine ticking over at about 2k it was generating 14.3-14.6V across the terminals.  So my question to all you aficionados of all things Kymco, any ideas as to what might be causing this?  My initial thoughts are:

1. The stator could be dodgy - more tests with the multimeter to come on a more clement occasion (when it isn't pissisting down). Not convinced about this though, although possible.
2. The regulator/rectifier could be on the fritz  - again not fully convinced without further analysis.
3. The instrument cluster might be fubar and could need replacing - I'm leaning toward this but will bend to better judgement than mine based on the balance of probabilities.
4. There might be a dodgy earth/short which is causing the errant display. - Not convinced but eminently possible as there are some rather naff aftermarket LED running lights that have been added which could be causing a drain - I'll be removing these as a matter of course when I tear the scoot down for a refurb).

Apparently the seller said that he did try another battery (allegedly known to be iffy) which had a lower CCA rating than the one which is installed and oddly, the screen behaved itself far better - this account may be apocryphal and I suspect it is.

One other symptom of weirdness according to the previous owner is that when first switching on the bike ignition, it has been necessary to wait 30 seconds or so before attempting to fire it up, or there is no response from the starter button.   ::)  I've just been outside and tried it and if fired up first kick without any delay.

Any help anyone could offer would be very much appreciated .

KR

Faversham
Regards

Faversham

Farkhem Hall, Tittering, Middle England.


Current Wheels:
Kymco Xciting 500i
Honda CX500
Yamaha R125
Previous:
BMW RT1100
Honda RD03 Africa Twin 750
Kawasaki GPZ500s
Derbi Terra Adventure 125
Countless Lambrettas

Lord Faversham

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2019, 10:25:48 AM »
Bit of an update -

I've pulled the fairing off the front of the bike as the headlamp bulb gave out on the way home last night.  I've found out that someone has installed a rather nasty aftermarket HID system to the scoot along with some crappy LEDs which I have removed and I am returning the wiring to stock.  Anyone have any idea as to why I would have 2 sets of connections for each side of the front indicator lights?

Additional regarding the instrument binnacle:  When I turn on the ignition, I get no CEL flash up.  I'll pull the unit and check all the connections but it seems probable that the instrument unit is nerfed.

Regards

Faversham

Farkhem Hall, Tittering, Middle England.


Current Wheels:
Kymco Xciting 500i
Honda CX500
Yamaha R125
Previous:
BMW RT1100
Honda RD03 Africa Twin 750
Kawasaki GPZ500s
Derbi Terra Adventure 125
Countless Lambrettas

CROSSBOLT

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2019, 01:33:13 PM »
Having NO personal experience with this model but having read a great many posts of others with both this model and similar problems, it is my OPINION that you have 1. A very viable stator and regulator-rectifier based on your enviable voltage checks, 2. Grounding AND connectivity issues throughout the electrical system and 3. May have SERIOUS wiring faults caused by previous owner insults to good wiring practices. 1. Your charging system appears excellent but the battery may be in question. Less CCA/amp-hour ratings is in the wrong direction since Kymco has been very stingy with batteries across the board. Equal to or bigger CCA/amp-hour ratings that will physically fit in the box recommended. Yuasa is a good brand to wish. 2. Unplug EVERY connector on this machine and apply silicon dielectric grease to ALL connections, reconnect. Disconnect ALL grounding points, clean EACH terminal lug and inspect every crimp to the wire. Replace the lug if green is visible. 3. Correct or eliminate all wiring changes by previous owner. Post the results when finished. 2008 was a long time ago (.....ah...11 years...) you have much work to do but it is worth it, in my OPINION. Other's Milage May Vary!
Karl

Three motorcycles 1960-1977 (restored a 1955 BSA)
Agility 50
Yager 200i
Downtown 300i
Navy tech, Ships Engineer, pilot and aircraft mechanic

Lord Faversham

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2019, 02:49:07 PM »
Thanks for that Karl

As things go, I've another update - I pulled the binnacle and had it a-part. it all looks ok to me and doesn't smell toasty which is a good sign.  I cleaned up the contacts and put it back together and lo and behold - it works! Crud on the contacts I would guess.  That is good news!

The starting issue simply isn't an issue - it all works as it should - I suspect pilot error on the part of the previous owner as he didn't even bother to fix the seat latch which wasn't lathcing properly.  A quick teardown and adjust/lube and its all working as it should now. 

I've torn orf all the offending HID/LED-related wiring and made good/repaired with proper solder/shrink wrap where necessary and I'm now just waiting for the OEM parts to arrive and re-assembly will follow.

So far, so hoopy.  However.....

After I got back from my 100 mile dash yesterday to bring the scoot back home, I hopped off it outside the house for a breather whilst waiting for #1 son to catch me up and let me into the house (my keys were in his car)...  When I started the scoot back up again, the exhaust was blowing like the very devil.  I wasn't too worried as I knew the exhaust needed replacing  and I have ordered a new replacement. On inspection today, I've found that there is a pipe immediately adjacent to the exhaust header on the LHS of the engine (looking forward) which has rusted through and has snapped off. It is this which is making almost all the exhaust racket. It disappears up into the guts of the scoot on the left hand side and if I didn't know any better, I'd think it was a coolant pipe but it seems to be almost like a secondary exhaust.  I've attached a pic with the offending article ringed. (top of the pic is toward the front of the bike and bottom towards the back). 

Not being familiar with small single pot four strokes (2 strokers are much more my bag) does anyone know what it is?  Either way, I suspect I have a right game of soldiers ahead of me in trying to get the old one off going by the state of the stud bolts but at least I can get a replacement ordered up.
Regards

Faversham

Farkhem Hall, Tittering, Middle England.


Current Wheels:
Kymco Xciting 500i
Honda CX500
Yamaha R125
Previous:
BMW RT1100
Honda RD03 Africa Twin 750
Kawasaki GPZ500s
Derbi Terra Adventure 125
Countless Lambrettas

xsel777

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2019, 03:34:07 PM »
I am sure that is a coolant pipe, so it is imperative that the issue be resolved ASAP.
I think the barnicles also are a giveaway, in that liquid corrosion has occurred.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2019, 03:36:48 PM by xsel777 »
2010 Kymco Xciting 500Ri-Dark Blue

Lord Faversham

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2019, 04:43:30 PM »
Thanks for that.  Its what I assumed. That might suggest that I either got lucky and it only let go after I got home with a change in temperature (unlikely - I have loads of luck but unfortunately most of it is of the brown variety) or I rode home best part of 100 miles with no coolant  :o  Oddly the temp gauge didn't budge at all during the journey and performance didn't seem in the least iffy so I may have got lucky.....

You can see it better in this image - its the u-shaped shiny pipe in the foreground adjacent to the exhaust header attached with bronze coloured nuts. 
.
Ah well.  I guess that's all the plastics off tomorrow then and a check on the coolant system, compression, etc etc etc.  Deep joy.....
Regards

Faversham

Farkhem Hall, Tittering, Middle England.


Current Wheels:
Kymco Xciting 500i
Honda CX500
Yamaha R125
Previous:
BMW RT1100
Honda RD03 Africa Twin 750
Kawasaki GPZ500s
Derbi Terra Adventure 125
Countless Lambrettas

Lord Faversham

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2019, 05:00:39 PM »
Its the PAIR valve feed from the head to the valve (I have no clue - never heard of one before!  Hell of an admission for a petrolhead).  The good news is that it wasn't a coolant pipe so that would explain why i still have all my coolant and the engine didn't overheat at any stage.  It might also explain the occasional misfire at high rpm as it is an emissions-related bit of kit (apparently).

Whatever, its going to get removed and replaced.

Whilst I anticipated some spannering, this is turning out to be quite the learning experience!
Regards

Faversham

Farkhem Hall, Tittering, Middle England.


Current Wheels:
Kymco Xciting 500i
Honda CX500
Yamaha R125
Previous:
BMW RT1100
Honda RD03 Africa Twin 750
Kawasaki GPZ500s
Derbi Terra Adventure 125
Countless Lambrettas

xsel777

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2019, 11:18:06 PM »
Great news.
2010 Kymco Xciting 500Ri-Dark Blue

BigBlue505

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2019, 02:10:52 PM »
While we're on the subject of instruments, how accurate are all your speedometers?  Mine's way off even with the proper-sized front tire.  To get correct speed, I divide the KPH reading (you can hardly see the MPH numbers) by two, and come up with a fairly accurate MPH.  120 KPH indicated is actually about 100 KPH actual. I'm used to converting KM to Miles, so it's not a real problem.  I haven't really checked the accuracy of my odometer.  It's difficult when you can hardly read the LCD display.
2008 Kymco Xciting
New Mexico

Stig / Major Tom

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2019, 12:11:45 PM »
Yeah, seen those chrome pipes on other scoots.
Regarding the two sets of indicator leads....some scoots have external pods for turn signals, while most also have a set in the front body panels. USA regs say we must have signals in the position of the pods, and delete current to the signals within the front panel.
Btw, Farkem Hall.....y'all up around Cleveland then? Or?....

Welcome to the circus.
Stig
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And, I'm feeling a little peculiar.

Lord Faversham

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2019, 12:19:33 PM »
Thanks Stig

That answers the question regarding the extra bits in the loom perfectly.

(As regards the Farkem Hall thing, Some might wonder "where's the fox hat?"  (try saying that with an upper class British accent and then try the same thing with Farkem Hall and you might get my drift..... ;)

I'm afraid it's my rather twisted SoH mixed with my online alter-ego which suggests an imaginary stately pile somewhere in the wilds of Middle England. 
Regards

Faversham

Farkhem Hall, Tittering, Middle England.


Current Wheels:
Kymco Xciting 500i
Honda CX500
Yamaha R125
Previous:
BMW RT1100
Honda RD03 Africa Twin 750
Kawasaki GPZ500s
Derbi Terra Adventure 125
Countless Lambrettas

Lord Faversham

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2019, 06:15:06 PM »
Update on the weirdness from the instruments. It was caused by some non-standard crappy LED wiring and lamps. They’ve all been removed and set back to standard and now it’s all good. [emoji106]


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Regards

Faversham

Farkhem Hall, Tittering, Middle England.


Current Wheels:
Kymco Xciting 500i
Honda CX500
Yamaha R125
Previous:
BMW RT1100
Honda RD03 Africa Twin 750
Kawasaki GPZ500s
Derbi Terra Adventure 125
Countless Lambrettas

CROSSBOLT

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2019, 08:12:33 PM »
Those LED lamps buzzed the instruments? The PO rat's nest wiring contributed? Oh, that is a scary thing!
Karl

Three motorcycles 1960-1977 (restored a 1955 BSA)
Agility 50
Yager 200i
Downtown 300i
Navy tech, Ships Engineer, pilot and aircraft mechanic

Lord Faversham

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2019, 11:22:04 PM »
They sure did. There was a balance unit and the wiring was just atrocious. All bodged and loads of insulation tape. No solder.

I cut out the crap and spliced it all back together with proper solder and heat shrink. It’s all working just fine now.


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Regards

Faversham

Farkhem Hall, Tittering, Middle England.


Current Wheels:
Kymco Xciting 500i
Honda CX500
Yamaha R125
Previous:
BMW RT1100
Honda RD03 Africa Twin 750
Kawasaki GPZ500s
Derbi Terra Adventure 125
Countless Lambrettas

CROSSBOLT

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Re: Instrument weirdness
« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2019, 12:39:39 AM »
Outstanding!
Karl

Three motorcycles 1960-1977 (restored a 1955 BSA)
Agility 50
Yager 200i
Downtown 300i
Navy tech, Ships Engineer, pilot and aircraft mechanic

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