Author Topic: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)  (Read 2973 times)

118118

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Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« on: August 26, 2019, 02:55:09 PM »
Hi, this is my 4th Kymco, but my first with fuel injection. I got the scooter second hand at just over 2 years old with 3000 km on the clock.
I've given the scooter a full service and since covered around 400 km.
On last run out (2 days ago) all was fine and and returned home and put the scooter away in the garage.
Today, started the engine but the orange engine management light will not go out. I've unplugged/reconnected most of the electrical plug and the battery, but the light is still lit.
Start and runs OK, but don't trust it to go for a ride!
Any suggestions? or is there a 'plug in' diagnostic tool i could get?
My nearest dealer is 60 miles away. I'm in the UK.


Thanks
« Last Edit: August 26, 2019, 03:04:39 PM by 118118 »

CROSSBOLT

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2019, 05:59:13 PM »
That light should flas a code of short or long and short combinations if that EFI system like all the rest in the Kymco Korral. Yes there is a tool to read the fault codes. Your dealer SHOULD have one but most don't. To see the code flash, just turn ignition on but don't start the engine. Within 5 seconds that orange CELP light should be flashing a code. 
Karl

Three motorcycles 1960-1977 (restored a 1955 BSA)
Agility 50
Yager 200i
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118118

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2019, 09:50:19 AM »
Hi Karl,

Thanks for the reply,
Checked again this morning and the CELP light just stays on (no flashing). It is always lit when you turn the ignition on, the fuel pump then runs for 7 or 8 seconds and stops. But the light normally goes out when the engine starts.
It just says in the owner manual that if the CELP light stays on, take it immediately to your dealer.  Fat lot of use they are in my experience!

CROSSBOLT

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #3 on: August 27, 2019, 11:06:54 AM »
Hi Karl,

Thanks for the reply,
Checked again this morning and the CELP light just stays on (no flashing). It is always lit when you turn the ignition on, the fuel pump then runs for 7 or 8 seconds and stops. But the light normally goes out when the engine starts.
It just says in the owner manual that if the CELP light stays on, take it immediately to your dealer.  Fat lot of use they are in my experience!
I am the resident complainer about dealers and their techs! I do not have a service manual for your model so will assume it is a similar system to other EFI machines in the Kymco stable. The CELP symbol continually lighted but with no blinky code?  Initial sequence is all warning/info lights lit during self-test then all go out after self-test except oil pressure symbol (if equipped). This includes CELP symbol. Then after a few seconds the CELP symbol should flash a code if there is a problem. CELP does NOT flash code with engine running, it just stays on to alert a problem. So, are you allowing enough time after self-test? 10 seconds max...

Service manual for DT300i and other EFI models state CELP is lit for two seconds with key on (no engine start) then goes out for five seconds before flashing codes.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2019, 01:46:09 PM by CROSSBOLT »
Karl

Three motorcycles 1960-1977 (restored a 1955 BSA)
Agility 50
Yager 200i
Downtown 300i
Navy tech, Ships Engineer, pilot and aircraft mechanic

CROSSBOLT

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2019, 01:51:39 PM »
I forgot to say the Kymco analyzer tool is available to anyone with 200 USD plus shipping. While the tool is NOT absolutely necessary, it really comes in handy. I have no idea how much this thing is UK. Everything there seems really, REALLY expensive compared to here in US. I will guess if you got one, you would be instantly popular since most dealers are too tight to buy one.
Karl

Three motorcycles 1960-1977 (restored a 1955 BSA)
Agility 50
Yager 200i
Downtown 300i
Navy tech, Ships Engineer, pilot and aircraft mechanic

118118

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #5 on: August 27, 2019, 02:13:06 PM »
Thanks Karl,

$200 is expensive. A little more info: disconnected the battery for an hour and made sure it was fully charged.
Turned the ignition on for over a minute and the CELP light just remained lit. no flashing!

Still no joy. Just cant work out why it was OK when i returned from a ride and 2 days later it has this fault on start up!!!!!!!

CROSSBOLT

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #6 on: August 27, 2019, 02:47:24 PM »
You just did what I was going to suggest: disconnect battery! I will study the wiring diagram and some tea leaves....maybe check with some swami on a mountain...!

At this point, not knowing the wiring in that machine, I am guessing that you may have an unintentional ground somewhere. I studied the diagram for the DT300i and that was all I could come up with. I am confident the dealer tech is not going to have any idea on this and you probably would be ignored just like me when I ask questions of Kymco Taiwan. These EFI systems may all be Keihin from Japan and maybe they might respond. The only test that seems reasonable is to disconnect the instrument cluster and the ECU then test the wire for the CELP light to see if it is grounded. If it shows grounded then find where and tape it up.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2019, 02:59:27 PM by CROSSBOLT »
Karl

Three motorcycles 1960-1977 (restored a 1955 BSA)
Agility 50
Yager 200i
Downtown 300i
Navy tech, Ships Engineer, pilot and aircraft mechanic

118118

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2019, 02:01:47 PM »
Update:

After unpluging everything again the CELP light is still on permanently!
As I said, it starts and runs ok. I decided to risk going for a ride. First a short journey so i could push it home if required!  ;)
All was ok so i went a little further. In the end I rode for 23 mile and the scooter performed perfectly - but with the CELP light on all the time. Stopped and started it, but the orange light remains!  >:(


CROSSBOLT

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2019, 03:31:20 PM »
That seems to confirm it is not an actual problem with the EFI but something like an unintentional ground as said before. Saw your other post and that would be great if you could hook up with someone with an analyzer! How far away were the dealers?
Karl

Three motorcycles 1960-1977 (restored a 1955 BSA)
Agility 50
Yager 200i
Downtown 300i
Navy tech, Ships Engineer, pilot and aircraft mechanic

Neil955i

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2019, 03:48:48 PM »
I am the resident complainer about dealers and their techs! I do not have a service manual for your model so will assume it is a similar system to other EFI machines in the Kymco stable. The CELP symbol continually lighted but with no blinky code?  Initial sequence is all warning/info lights lit during self-test then all go out after self-test except oil pressure symbol (if equipped). This includes CELP symbol. Then after a few seconds the CELP symbol should flash a code if there is a problem. CELP does NOT flash code with engine running, it just stays on to alert a problem. So, are you allowing enough time after self-test? 10 seconds max...

Service manual for DT300i and other EFI models state CELP is lit for two seconds with key on (no engine start) then goes out for five seconds before flashing codes.

Hello there, depending where you are in the UK, I know a good dealership with a knowledgable mechanic equipped with full diagnostic tools, they're in Crewe?
Regards & ride safe,
Neil

Current garage:  Kymco DTX360 & Triumph Street Triple 675R
Past bikes: BSA C15. Honda S/wing (GL500). Kawasaki GPz750. BMW K100RS. Kawasaki GPZ900R. Yamaha FJ1200 x2. Sprint. Triumph Daytona 900. Kawasaki ZX-7R. T595 Daytona. Kawasaki ZX-9R x2. Triumph Daytona 955i. X-Town

JJJoseph

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2019, 06:56:04 AM »
I've raised this same issue a couple of times, but there's a hard core of resistance here to new technology.  Some members follow the 1970s method of trying to decode blinking lights, but this is a total dead-end with new EFI machines.  The only way to diagnose these machines is to use the proper diagnostic tools.  Every dealer has the diagnostics device and knows how to use it, but if you don't have a local dealer, there's no answer - except for trying to count the blinking light pattern.  Let me share a story with you: About 30 years ago I had an old Chevy van with a CEL that would give one long blink followed by 2 short blinks. Or it was the other way round.  This indicated either "12" - or "21".  I asked the GM dealer what  was it trying to say.  He said "12" meant the throttle-body fuel injection needed replacement, and a "21" meant the ABS system needed repair.  The van otherwise ran fine.  I asked how do I know which message it's trying to tell me.  He said,"First you replace the fuel injectors.  If the light is still blinking, it's a "21", not a "12", and you need to replace the ABS system.  It's like flipping a coin.  In the end, I put a piece of black electrical tape over the blinking light and drove it for another 100,000km.  It was still blinking when I sold it years later.

The take-away: Don't buy an EFI machine unless you have access to the diagnostic tools, either your own or the dealer's - it doesn't matter which.  Without the tools you'll never figure out what it's trying to tell you!
« Last Edit: August 30, 2019, 07:01:19 AM by JJJoseph »

Stig / Major Tom

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Re: Kymco Agility 16+ (City + 125cc)
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2019, 11:18:45 AM »
One18one18,
I think I'd keep doing a test ride or 2, then forgetabout-it, if you can't get to a dealer, and ride if it's running well, showing no signs of everheating, good oil, etc.
Stig


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« Last Edit: August 30, 2019, 11:21:52 AM by Stig »
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