Kymco Like 200i Power loss

[Stig / Major Tom]

This is a common problem with Kymco 200i (fuel injected) scooters.  You can read about many of them here on KymcoForum. Unfortunately, there's nothing you can do since the problem can't be diagnosed.  It's kind of sad to read all the desperate suggestions like valve clearance adjustments, plugged exhaust, or blocked breather caps.  This is a chronic Kymco failing.  There is no support for Kymco F/I scooters from the factory or distributor. There's nothing that can be done except to scrap the machine and buy a different make that is supported by dealer diagnostics. I've heard that the basic engine is quite excellent and can be sold to Honda Ruckus drivers who then convert the engine to a carbureted version.  The rest of the Kymco can usually be sold for scrap.  It might be useful to hear from Kymco owners who have managed to convert their 200i machines to carbureted models, which would solve the problem completely.

Well JJJ,
You have frequently written of your dislike of Kymco dealer & factory support, and fuel injected Kymco scooters.

However:
It is incorrect to characterize the Kymco 200i scooter as having common and chronic problems. To do so implies that 200i engine problems are usual & frequent & constantly recurring - which is absolutely not true. Actually the LIKE200i has been  one of Kymco's most reliable platforms for a decade.
When you state something as fact, "the 200i has common/chronic" problems - that won't go uncontested.

You incorrectly state that the scooter cannot be repaired - and characterize member suggestions as desperate, etc., etc., etc.


Very few LIKE200i owners are selling their scooters for scrap. Most are happily riding them into the ground on several continents.

In spite of your stated 60 yrs of riding, do understand that your opinion, is just that...one member's opinion. And you're welcome to it. Readers can decide for themselves, what to make of your tone and opinions.

However - characterizing any members comments as desperate, pointless, pathetic and clueless is not welcome here. And so, those remarks have been deleted.

Also, a scooter forum is not the appropriate platform to discuss the hot topic of global warming - therefore those posts have been deleted as well.

Stig

[JJJoseph]

Thanks, Stig- When the topic gets so far off track (e.g. global warming), it needs a helping hand!

[CROSSBOLT]

This is a common problem with Kymco 200i (fuel injected) scooters.  You can read about many of them here on KymcoForum. Unfortunately, there's nothing you can do since the problem can't be diagnosed.  It's kind of sad to read all the desperate suggestions like valve clearance adjustments, plugged exhaust, or blocked breather caps.  This is a chronic Kymco failing.  There is no support for Kymco F/I scooters from the factory or distributor. There's nothing that can be done except to scrap the machine and buy a different make that is supported by dealer diagnostics. I've heard that the basic engine is quite excellent and can be sold to Honda Ruckus drivers who then convert the engine to a carbureted version.  The rest of the Kymco can usually be sold for scrap.  It might be useful to hear from Kymco owners who have managed to convert their 200i machines to carbureted models, which would solve the problem completely.

I, too, must address this as I am waiting for the original poster, Marco to eventually discover what the REAL cause of his problem. The real value of this and other forums is to collect valid information about the machines they ride and hopefully correct whatever problems may arise. The one typical problem that affects ALL brands and models is the vacuum operated vent valve for the gas tank which sticks shut. This actually was a problem discovered in about 2008 on the Genuine Buddy forum and was called the "Stall of Shame." The Buddy 150 (my wife's bike) was a well built, delightful rig that would lose power and eventually quit. Since it was a carburetor fed engine you had to wait while you fiddled with restart to fill the float bowl enough to actually get it to light off. Kymcos as a general rule, are well made, reliable machines with just a few exceptions. The Like 200i, DT300i and People GTi300 are not exceptions. Neither was the Agility 50 nor the Yager 200i. I can attest because I, we have owned and ridden those models for many tens of thousands of miles and have solved ALL the real problems that cropped up. Now, I have no feeling about Australian mechanics are like but I have experienced both directly and through others what American motorcycle/scooter techs are like and my conclusion is you will get straight answers here and not the dealer. My opinion on this is well known here and I will go no futher. Suffice, a LOT of time and energy and thought has gone into this experience and cannot be discounted by anyone. Further, the Kymco EFI machines have proven reliability with few exceptions. I am saying, there are few machine failures but many human failures. With that, I rest my case.

[JJJoseph]

I can understand others being irritated with my take on Kymco fuel-injected machines, especially if your machine is reliable and predictable.  I've had the misfortune of recommending Kymco 200s (Agility & Yager) to two friends and both machines have come to the end of useful life at less than 6,000 miles.  Both will start, but misfire constantly when driven, and the nearest dealer (about 75 miles away) has been unable to repair either one.  It's embarrassing, to me, to see a scooter end up like this.  I made the recommendations, and it was a disaster.   

FWIW, it would be really helpful if motorcycles had OBD-2 diagnostic ports like all cars.  But they don't!  Believe me, if there was a real solution, one that actually worked, I'd be the most thankful rider in scooter-dom!

[CROSSBOLT]

I can understand others being irritated with my take on Kymco fuel-injected machines, especially if your machine is reliable and predictable.  I've had the misfortune of recommending Kymco 200s (Agility & Yager) to two friends and both machines have come to the end of useful life at less than 6,000 miles.  Both will start, but misfire constantly when driven, and the nearest dealer (about 75 miles away) has been unable to repair either one.  It's embarrassing, to me, to see a scooter end up like this.  I made the recommendations, and it was a disaster.   

FWIW, it would be really helpful if motorcycles had OBD-2 diagnostic ports like all cars.  But they don't!  Believe me, if there was a real solution, one that actually worked, I'd be the most thankful rider in scooter-dom!

Your last paragraph has one statement that is incorrect: the EFI bikes by Kymco really DO have an OBD II-type port that connects to the "Kymco Analyzer Tool." This connector is a three pin affair that is easily missed. This connector and the tool (reader) will easily display many ECU parameters which OCCASIONALLY are the source of malfunctions. Most of the time, the problems with the EFI Kymcos are caused by stuck fuel tank vent valves, bad electrical connections, marginal batteries and failed charging systems, to name a few.

[scooterfan]

I can understand others being irritated with my take on Kymco fuel-injected machines, especially if your machine is reliable and predictable.  I've had the misfortune of recommending Kymco 200s (Agility & Yager) to two friends and both machines have come to the end of useful life at less than 6,000 miles.  Both will start, but misfire constantly when driven, and the nearest dealer (about 75 miles away) has been unable to repair either one.  It's embarrassing, to me, to see a scooter end up like this.  I made the recommendations, and it was a disaster.   

Thanks for being honest. It surely helps to make informative decisions.
I can feel your embarrassment - have learned the same lesson the hard way myself.
Thanks again.

[mousejunks]

As an owner of a Kymco with 80,000km, it's probably caused by a bad wire or connection somewhere. Had plenty of electrical niggles in my DT300's lifetime but all repairable.

Other things you can you for misfiring is clean the MAF sensor, check the entire ignition circuit (e.g. kill switch, relays, spark plug boot, condenser, crankshaft position sensor) for corrosion or loose connections and fuel injector.

[marcohildebrandt]

Update on the power loss issue, the dealer on the Gold Coast has checked everything including fuel system, electrical system and has temporarily put a new Like 200i exhaust system on my scooter which solved the issue. But a new genuine exhaust in Australia costs around $AU 1200    Apparently there is a catalytic converter in the exhaust!

Now we have to find a reasonable after market exhaust available in Australia.... or get what I can for it and buy a motorcycle

[scooterfan]

Update on the power loss issue, the dealer on the Gold Coast has checked everything including fuel system, electrical system and has temporarily put a new Like 200i exhaust system on my scooter which solved the issue. But a new genuine exhaust in Australia costs around $AU 1200    Apparently there is a catalytic converter in the exhaust!

Now we have to find a reasonable after market exhaust available in Australia.... or get what I can for it and buy a motorcycle

If legal in your country to use any means of transport without catalytic converters , you could consider removing the catalytic converter at the original exhaust. A blocked catalytic converter is most probably causing the problem.
Depending on the position of a possible Lamda sensor at the original exhaust, the scooter might still run perfectly without a catalytic converter - and without replacing a possible Lamda sensor with an aftermarket unit.

On my previous bike (Honda NC 700) the catalytic convertor has been removed and the engine ran perfectly without replacing or removing any sensors.

On my wife’s car (Ford Focus 2 Liter Trend) the catalytic convertor has been removed, but the Lamda censor had to be replaced with an aftermarket unit. The car’s engine ran perfectly without the catalytic convertor, but the Lamda censor is linked to the car’s automatic gearbox and the original Lamda sensor seriously affected the gearbox behavior just after the cat convertor was removed.

The cat on my Honda motorcycle has been removed fairly easy by myself. The catalytic box has been cut in half carefully with an angle grinder, and after the cat was removed the cat box has just been closed and the loose half of the cat box had been welded in place again.

Should you remove the catalytic converter, just don't throw it away. The converters are often made of platinium, and you might be able to sell it to a breaker yard at a good price.

[JJJoseph]

you could consider removing the catalytic converter at the original exhaust. A blocked catalytic converter is most probably causing the problem.

OMG! With all due respect, I can't believe the suggestions this thread generates! This poor machine!  Is this much different from my suggestion to simply scrap the machine and sell the engine to a Ruckus owner? 

[scooterfan]

OMG! With all due respect, I can't believe the suggestions this thread generates! This poor machine!  Is this much different from my suggestion to simply scrap the machine and sell the engine to a Ruckus owner?

H
I don’t understand what you mean by “this poor machine “ and “I can’t beleve what this thread generates” ?
Removing catylists is quite common across the globe, and you mean you are still not aware of it ?
If you are still not aware of it I must admit - I am quite surprised about the comments this thread generates as well.
Or are you involved in forum politics ?

[mousejunks]

There's no emissions testing to renew a vehicle registration in Australia, so I'm all for removing the cat.

[CROSSBOLT]

This is the first malfunction I have heard caused by an exhaust cat converter! We all learned a new one!

Faced with a similar problem, I GUARANTEE the cat would be removed. 1200 AU is insane!

[Stig / Major Tom]

Update on the power loss issue, the dealer on the Gold Coast has checked everything including fuel system, electrical system and has temporarily put a new Like 200i exhaust system on my scooter which solved the issue. But a new genuine exhaust in Australia costs around $AU 1200    Apparently there is a catalytic converter in the exhaust!

Now we have to find a reasonable after market exhaust available in Australia.... or get what I can for it and buy a motorcycle

Thanks much for your update!!
I'm thinking a dealer wouldn't like to mess with removing an O2 sensor from your 5 yr old muffler. ...so he likely unplugged your O2 sensor and left it in your muffler when removing your ex. system.
Since a cat conv has no movable parts to wear out....perhaps a new O2 sensor (@$110 new, or less, used) would make your engine happy again?
Maybe have a careful look at your O2's wire and plug?
If all else fails cut that sucker with enough pipe left to fashion an ebay 'sport' exhaust on there !

Just sayin', I'd suspect the O2 sensor, before  the cat.
Good luck.
Stig
New exhause w/o the cat. is @$260 in USA...but gotta be a wrecked LIke down there, somewhere

[scooterfan]

A clogged cat can indeed have a serious effect on engine performance.
In my wife’s car’s case my wife started mentioning the car “has less power”. New spark plugs and new air cleaner did not make any difference.
Then my wife started mentioning the engine “ battles to start”. At that stage I started thinking the engine was on it’s way out.
Next thing, the engine warning light came on. I then took the car to a local Ford dealer. They hooked the car to a diagnostic tool, and they told me the cat needs to be replaced. The price they quoted on a new cat was completely insane. When the guy realized I would never be prepared to pay that price he referred me to a local specialist who “remove cat converters on Ford cars quite often”.
Since removal and installing an aftermarket Lambda sensor the difference in engine performance is quite substantial. The difference in engine power made us realize the cat should have been removed long ago.

Due to the better performance on the car engine I decided to remove the cat on the Honda motorcycle as well. After removal I couldn’t find any difference in engine performance, because the cat on the Honda was still fairly new.