fork oil change, with pics

[Iahawk]

to follow up from Ruffus's thread on changing fork oil on his Like 200i...I got the idea to change my fork oil to see if it helps the ride before I decide to completely replace the forks.

Removing the forks is easy. First remove the front cover (9 screws) and then the front wheel and caliper. Then you can remove the front fender (2 nuts and a screw, not necessary to remove fender to remove the fork but I wanted to take it off and clean it up, polish it and ceramic coat it).

Once all that is out of the way you loosen and remove the 2 bolts holding each fork and slide the fork down.

Pic 1 is the scoot with front cover, wheel, fender and 1 fork removed.

Pic 2 is the fork after removing the top rubber cap.

Pic 3 is how I was able to remove the cap. It requires pressing down very firmly on the cap while at the same time not compressing the fork. With the cap pressed in about a half inch you can remove the c clip holding the cap. I followed the directions from someone on youtube who placed a screwdriver in a vise then put put the fork between a stool and the screwdriver. Pushing the fork toward the vise and up compressed the cap and allows removal of the c clip with a small, thin screwdriver.

Pic 4 is the fork with cap, c clip and spring removed (note the progressive spring)

[Iahawk]

the next question was how much fork oil to add...in the referenced earlier thread both 80 ml and 97 ml were mentioned.

I poured out both forks into a measuring cup, trying to capture as much fluid as possible.

Pics 1 and 2 are the fluid I collected from each fork. I would say the 97 ml referenced is the correct amount!

Pic 3 is the new fluid I used, Bel Ray 10 wt...a nice, clean, green color

Pic 4 is the oddball...for some strange reason the fluid in each front fork was different! One fork was a clear/ slight green with a lot of dirt in it and the other fork was a red fluid with dirt. You can see the color of each where I put each fork spring on the paper towel and clearly see they are different. Who puts different fork oil in their forks? You always replace both at the same time!

I also took the opportunity to disassemble, clean and lube my caliper. The scoot is not all put back together because I found a small crack in my fender and I want to use JB Plastiweld to fix it...but tomorrow is Thanksgiving and most stores are closed so I'll have to wait until Friday to fix it and then hope I can ride on Saturday to see if the new oil improved the ride.

So I'll follow up with my thoughts on the ride once I'm back on the road.

[Neil955i]

Neat job Hawk, well done and hope you notice an improvement in the ride quality.

[Iahawk]

thanks, Neil. I can't wait to get it all back together. Had I known how easy it was to change the fluid I would have done this long ago! (I was also lucky in that the o-rings, and seals were all in good shape with no leaking, so a simple fluid change was all I needed).

[Stig / Major Tom]

Nice work Hawk!
How many miles on the scooter?
Or, is it years, rather than dampening cycles (miles ridden) which might make this necessary?

For my LIKE - I long ago started rejecting routes which had poor paving.
And was actually thinking just this morning that even though this thing has (like all scoots ) ridiculously small suspension travel, on both ends - its ride over the routes I run is certainly acceptable. . I've no plans to 'work' with the suspension on either of my scoots....but for those so interested - your description & pics will be of help!
Stig

[Iahawk]

the miles are low, just over 3000 on a 2010 model. The problem I've had since I've owned the scoot (bought in 2015 with 1863 miles) is the ride is very bad over rough roads. I've posted a few times about how i felt the frame was made of rubber due to the strong shaking of the handlebars when I'm riding. It felt like I was running a jackhammer at times. It's not a vertical shaking but more of a forward / back shaking of the bars.

It turns out it's not a rubbery frame but very poor initial damping of the forks. It's as if the first 1/4 to 1/2 inch of travel is completely undamped and that translates to a jackhammer like feeling in the bars.

I can replicate the feel when the bike is on the center stand and I'm sitting on it. If I push the front end down quickly, almost bouncing the front wheel on and off the ground i get the shaking in the bars.

i compare the scoot to my motorcycle, which has zero of the jackhammer type feel. I'm hoping that doing something with the forks will fix this issue and that it's not just the way the scoot is.

[Iahawk]

As promised, a follow up to my fork oil change.  I used JB Plastiweld along with some fiberglass mesh drywall tape  to repair 2 small cracks in my front fender (not that anyone would ever see them but I know they are there and wanted to repair).

And, as usually happens with me, I created more work for myself from the sanding I did inside the fender on the crack repair areas. Some of the sanding grit must have got on my work surface and I dragged my shiny black fender through it...requiring more compounding and polishing to remove all traces of the new scratches.

Once that was fixed I reassembled the front end on my scooter and took her out for a ride with the new fork oil.

Wow. New scooter. The ride was 10x better than previously. It was actually comfortable and pleasant. The crashing over every expansion strip and the jackhammer -like vibration in my grips/bars was gone.

Granted, the ride is still not luxurious..it's still a cheap scooter suspension..but wow. Absolutely night and day difference.

I really noticed the difference as the speed increased. At an indicated 42 - 50 mph the ride was smooth. Previously the ride would become almost unbearable at those speeds on anything less than glass smooth roads due to the forward/backward shaking of the bars.

Thank you Ruffus for your initial post on changing your fork oil..that made me decide to do it, too. For $15 in new fork oil and a few hours of my time I  have what feels like a brand new scooter.

[scooterfan]

It turns out it's not a rubbery frame but very poor initial damping of the forks. It's as if the first 1/4 to 1/2 inch of travel is completely undamped and that translates to a jackhammer like feeling in the bars.

I think my Agility has a similar problem. When I pull the front brake only the forks go down about 1/4 to 1/2 inch with a cracking noise when it “bottoms” at about 1/2 inch.
Unfortunately I use my Agility for daily commuting and I do not have time to have a look at the forks in the near future.

Anyway, thanks for the comments and photos, this will be very helpful.

[Iahawk]

Scooterfan, when you can find the time, definitely give changing your fork oil a try. I can't believe the difference it made in my scoot. I would guess that our forks are very similar so hopefully you'll see a huge improvement, too.

[Stig / Major Tom]

Scooterfan, when you can find the time, definitely give changing your fork oil a try. I can't believe the difference it made in my scoot. I would guess that our forks are very similar so hopefully you'll see a huge improvement, too.

Curious here Hawk,
What do you attribute the difference to?
Wrong weight of oil, wrong amount of oil, or ??
I forget - did you measure the old oil?
Stig

[CROSSBOLT]

the miles are low, just over 3000 on a 2010 model. The problem I've had since I've owned the scoot (bought in 2015 with 1863 miles) is the ride is very bad over rough roads. I've posted a few times about how i felt the frame was made of rubber due to the strong shaking of the handlebars when I'm riding. It felt like I was running a jackhammer at times. It's not a vertical shaking but more of a forward / back shaking of the bars.

Bad ride when I "test rode" a Like for my wife a few years ago. My comment was "harsh" and disappointed. She loved it and that was all I was concerned about! It was to replace a Buddy 150 since it was a less than ideal cruiser for trips.

Your fork project looks so doable it has me tempted! The ride on the DT300i is pretty good but methinks it could be better. Besides, that questionable oil is a shocker! We all change the gear lube right after purchase and the factory stuff usually looks like old soda pop!

[Iahawk]

Curious here Hawk,
What do you attribute the difference to?
Wrong weight of oil, wrong amount of oil, or ??
I forget - did you measure the old oil?
Stig

Stig, my old oil was dirty, one (or both?) of the fork oils may have been 10 years old, as there were clearly 2 different kinds of oil in my forks and the front end made noise as I bounced it up and down.

I measured the oil from both forks and they were the same so I don't believe that was the problem. I replaced it with a similar amount. I also used the recommended 10W oil. My thought is that new, clean fluid replacing old, worn out dirty fluid made the difference. And what a difference it made. Noticeable after about the first 20 feet of riding.

 I wish I'd done this a few years ago.

[Ruffus]

@Hawk
Good to read of your success in front dampers.
Btw: nice and tidy workshop you have. I like your way how you fixed the damper in your vice.

[Iahawk]

thanks, Ruffus. Workshop area is not quite as tidy as I'd like it to be but it will do for now. I can't take credit for the idea of using a vice and a stool to compress the fork cap for removal. I saw it done on youtube and it's actually very effective. I'm not sure how I would have removed the cap if I hadn't seen that method used.

[hoodellyhoo]

Thanks for the very informative post! This is a job I'm looking at doing soon since mine's a 2007 and I'm pretty sure the fork oil is original