tire crack

[super 88]

Its been two weeks and the MTO has not yet replied with an answer. BTW the director of parts and service for Kymco Canada has flipflopped on the safety issue, and now claims that he is not advising me that the tire is safe to ride on, nor has he signed a safety certificate to that end.

Yet they won't replace the tire, suggesting that I have damaged the tire by riding on it underinflated. I check tire pressure often, and these ones both keep their pressure very well. Even if that were the case, I think it is highly improbable that only one side of the tire would be so severely damaged, while the other side is still in perfect condition.

I think it's a sad reflection of Kymco Canada's commitment to customer satisfaction and safety.

The scary bit is that if I had simply accepted the original assessment by Kymco Canada - that the tire is safe to ride on, and had taken my kid out for a spin, hit a pothole... the consequences could have been catastrophic.

BTW Agent Bob, interesting theory. I had the same thought, and mentioned it to KC but received no reply in that regard.

[JustWantToRide]

While you purchased the scooter as new - it is a 3 year old bike with 3+ year old tires.   

There should be a 4 digit number in the sidewall - something like 4407.  The first 2 digits are the week, the other 2 are the year.

In the sidewall you could say that delamination is cosmetic - but that is too close to the bead for comfort if you ask me.   Since it only did it on one side the bike probably sat somewhere with either light hitting it or air blowing across it - they both make the rubber degrade faster.  How's the rear tire look?

[super 88]

Hey JWTR,

I put on my high-powered reading specs and sure enough, the rear tire is showing the same symptoms, again only on one side of the tire, the same side as the front tire. I will post photos once my daughter comes home and snaps them. Not only is there delamination, but the same cracking right at the bead, although it is not as prominent on the rear tire as it is on the front tire.

I know the bike is 3 years old, and hence the tires must be as well.  When I purchased the bike, I asked if the dealer would bring in a 2010 model for me, but he made a convincing case for putting me over the curb on the 2008, saying that was is exactly the same bike, with the same full two year warranty, and he would move on the price.

Tires age was not something that even crossed my mind at the time I bought the bike.

I have since read about several cases where dealers were knowingly selling bikes with older tires on them, and not disclosing the pitfalls and dangers of this practice to the customer. In one case concerning Harley Davidsons that were subsequently involved in accidents on these older tires, the dealer was held responsible. The court found that it was incumbent upon the dealer to adequately explain the dangers associated with riding on older tires - something that they failed to do.

Similarly, my dealer never mentioned anything about the aging tires on my "new-with-full-factory-warranty" 2008 Xciting 500Ri.

Whenever an "old stock" new bike is sold - and I'm sure I'm neither the first nor the last customer to purchase an "old stock" new scooter - it would seem to me that the dealer should fully inform the customer of the possibility of premature tire failure - premature in the sense that failure can occur at very low mileage. My tires have 3000 km (1800 miles) on them, and now it appears that they both will need to be replaced.

Kymco Canada continues to insist that since tires are not covered under my warranty, I must absorb the full cost of replacing the front tire, and apparently the rear tire as well.

I love the bike, but in my estimation, Kymco Canada has failed in this instance to provide adequate customer information, service and consequently - satisfaction. Further, I feel that their "concern" for rider safety is woefully lacking, as demonstrated by the quote in the second post of this thread.

The bike has been sitting for three weeks, unridden, as I cannot afford a new front tire at this time, and now that I've seen the rear tire cracks today, it looks as though I will have to cancel my insurance and park the bike until I can scrape up the money to replace both tires.

So it looks like the riding season has already ended for me, unless Kymco Canada steps up to the plate to address the issue. Given my experience with them over the last three weeks, I just don't see this happening.

[super 88]

Rear tire pics...

Cracking along the bead:



Delamination:



Not as bad as the front tire, but at 1800 miles?  (The rear tire is better protected from light than the front, no doubt about that).  

I was surprised to learn that UV light can penetrate glass, such as that in my dealer's front window.  Apparently up to 97% 0f UVB is absorbed, allowing only 3% to pass through. However, it's a different story with UVA - only about 37% is filtered out, and the remainder (63% or roughly 2/3) freely penetrates straight through. Apparently, from what I've read, it's the UVA component that is nearest to the infrared spectrum (which can easily penetrate glass as well from what I've read online, and which apparently heats and thus dries rubber prematurely).  

I don't have exact dates on hand, but it seems that my scooter sat on display in the dealer's shop for at least one year. That's a lot of UVA and infrared exposure over a prolonged period. I've also learned that tires left sitting stagnant for such an extended period may be prone to premature cracking as well, as tires need "exercise" to help them retain their elasticity. I'm not sure how heating and air conditioning affect the elasticity of rubber, but it's pretty clear that both produce a very dry environment.

In any case, I'm now grounded. Happy trails to everyone here. Safe riding!

:Edited twice to get the UV-A and infrared bits sorted out due to conflicting information on the interwebs!:

[axy]

I think that you are wasting your time.

1. Nobody will tell you "the tire is safe" for sure, and will not put a stamp on that statement. Of course, everybody will say it is unsafe, just to be on the SAFE side. Personally, I think that tires are OK.

2. I have seen such minute cracks on pretty much all tires, especially OEMs, where the scoots stand in one place for prolonged period of time before purchase (parking lots, salons).

3. If you still feel unsafe, trash them and buy new ones, it is probably less than 100 US$ for sure.

I gave up long time ago on contacting, emailing and requesting anything from companies and shops where I bought my vehicles.
Also, I think that it is possible that there is nothing wrong with them.

[JustWantToRide]

The tire doesn't have to fail catastrophically to take you down.  The lateral forces on the tire near the bead have already caused it to crack right up next to the rim.  I would not assume that the rubber actually holding the tire to the rim is in significantly better condition, or that it will not allow the bead to slip - especially on the front tire.  

Perhaps you should contact Chen Shin and ask them if the tires are safe (your tires are CST tires right?).  If they say to replace them - then that may give you some leverage with the dealer and or Kymco.  It would also give you something that you can take to your local news station as a story of interest ("Local scooter dealer sells tires that the manufacturer claims are unsafe").

I'm not above threatening to shame a dealer into doing the right thing.  They can take a hit now and have a good public image, or lose sales because they are exposed for selling something as new which is not in a condition which should be considered new, let alone safe.



www.xcs.com.cn

Cheng Shin Rubber USA, Inc.
545 Old Peachtree Road
Suwanee, GA 30024, U.S.A.
Tel:1-800-462-9947
Fax:1-770-962-7705

Cheng Shin Rubber Ind. Co., Ltd.
8th Fl, World Trade Building
50, Sec. 1 Shin-Sheng S. Rd.,
Taipei, Taiwan
Tel: 886-2-2393-7451
Fax: 886-2-2341-4560

[super 88]

Thanks for your replies!

Actually JWTR, the tires are Maxxis - I sent them photos weeks ago and have yet to hear back from them.

Axy, you're obviously a road warrior with loads of experience, but I've had many experienced bikers have a look at the front tire up close, and they all say it's unsafe.  Of course , you have only seen the photos and haven't seen either tire up close and all the way around.

I cancelled my insurance this morning as times are tight for my kid and me. I can't afford new tires at this time.

I too have given up on contacting KYMCO CANADA - it's a one-way dead end street.

I've not yet given up working toward a solution via other means though. Thanks all for your replies, opinions and advice.  You've all been very helpful!

[axy]

I too have given up on contacting KYMCO CANADA - it's a one-way dead end street.

My point exactly.

I doubt there is any solace in the fact that no car or motorcycle factory is much better in after market consumer care, except, maybe, premium brands (Mercedes, BMW etc.)
Maybe, just MAYBE they would behave in a better manner.

[bongoman]

If you think the tire is unsafe, you are wise to continue checking it out.

[Agent Bob]

In a perfect world, the dealer would offer to sell you replacement tires at the wholesale price which he would install for free, if he wants to keep you as a valued customer. You can tell him it was your lawyer's suggestion. (Hint, hint.)

[ailixhomes]

Now a  days there is a comman problems for every  vehicle owners  to get a some crack form their tires.  In today's technology worlld it is to be consider as a fact that newly bikes or each two wheelers have a problems for crack the tires.

[sissy mary]

Wow, old thread/post. Just go's to show you. Never put a Cheng Shin on anything. Cheapest piece of crap on the market. People put them on because they are cheap. But they do not understand they wear out much faster. So you have to pay to have new ones installed more often. Not worth it.

[HOHO]

I don't need to show you pictures but I have the same year bike bought new last year (never been sold or ridden) and I have similar cracks around the rim.  They're not quite as extensive as yours but on a car tire this would suggest age.  On a bike tire?  New to me.  I've only got 6000k on it and bought the 2008 model new from the dealer with something like 54K on it.  It's still on the guarantee so the chief mechanic is writing to Kymco to see if it's on the warranty.  I'll check back in once I get an answer.  Good luck but so far I haven't had any problems and the air doesn't leak. (even after being outside all winter).

[Syl]

Years ago on a large bike on the turnpike going 70 the front tire blew, it was new never used before. After 4-5 years sitting in the rafters of a hot gararge not know was that the tire had sarted dry rotting enough to build up pressure and blow. I can give a accident report here from state police and me but it bothers me to even think about it. Whenever there is a tire question all I can say is get rid of it or them and go new. I was very very lucky.

[Syl]

I failed to mention and I'm not saying this is so with your tires...please understand. Some of the area on the tire that blew as I remember looked very sinilar to what you are showing. That is not normal for sure or all tires would show that or at least many others of the same brand. Wished I knew what you see and know.