Variator "Shifting"

[tuko]

That term I've read several times here and with my A50 I actually felt the scooter shifting while going up the rev band.



Would theses grooves have anything to do with that ?? LOL 

Installed the new Naraku HS variator set yesterday with the new straight boss. While at it I began the experiment with various roller weights.  As I wrote in an earlier thread, with the new 1000rpm contra spring I've had to go to heavier weights to get any performance from the A50.....Keep that in mind. 

So anyways I tried the 5.3g rollers that came with the kit and as I suspected the A50 shot right up to 25kph and stayed there. So I tried a new set of 8.5g rollers and from the start are they sluggish but once you get moving she goes well. Then I went back to the 8g rollers that I installed a few weeks ago and here she seems to perform the best.

I'm a big fan of the Dr. Pulley sliders and want to order a set but I'm a bit confused by several comments that I've been reading here and at other sites. Here the comment was made that you should go 1g higher once you found what suites you best and at another site they say to go .5g higher.    What is correct  and what is recommended from past experience?

Another thing I did noticed yesterday was that the mixture screw on the side of the carb was not properly set. According to the manual it should be 2½ turns out, then from there you can fine adjust. On mine she was 1½ turns, by turning it to 2½ turns the A50 seems to runs better but I do think that only going one jet size up wasn't enough. The spark plug is very clean, no residue so I'm of the though that she's running a bit lean so a set of M5 jets were ordered yesterday so that I can experiment there to.

Anyways I'm having fun with the A50 just unsure at this time what should I buy, 8.0g or 8.5g Dr Pulley sliders. ??


Tuko.

[Peters]

Would theses grooves have anything to do with that ?? LOL  Cheesy

Most definitely. Flat spots on the rollers will also do it.

A stiffer contra spring will require heavier rollers. It puts more tension on the belt thus making the variator shift slower, work harder, and the RPMs go higher. You should have gotten rid of that restricted boss drive a long time ago. That's part of the reason the face has groves. The belt should go all the way up the drive face.

Go 1 gram heavier for Dr. Pulleys

The idle mix screw doesn't have to be any specific number of turns. If it that was the case, it wouldn't be adjustable. It's different for everybody depending on climate, altitude, ect... The easiest way to set it is turn it 1/4 turn at a time until you get the highest RPMs. Then adjust the speed screw to the desired idle speed. You say it performs better now, that's a good thing.

[tuko]

Yes it does perform "better" now but she is still a bit sluggish when you give 'er full gas direct. I think this is due to a small jet.

I just bought this A50 a few weeks ago, so changing the boss was top of my priority list. She is getting better, just a few more tweaks and I'll have it as I want it.


Tuko.

[Peters]

Nice 

Yeah you don't want to run it lean

[streido]

Yes it does perform "better" now but she is still a bit sluggish when you give 'er full gas direct. I think this is due to a small jet.

I just bought this A50 a few weeks ago, so changing the boss was top of my priority list. She is getting better, just a few more tweaks and I'll have it as I want it.


Tuko.

Its sluggish because your using 8g rollers  

Stock weight is only 6.5g so your way over that. All that does it shift your gearing quicker so youre getting into high gear before you should be and losing the sweet spot. I could not ride my A50 on anything heavier than 5.5g-6g, even that is too heavy for me, i use 5.1g rollers and im on a 1500rpm torque spring where youre only on a 1000rpm one!!! Lighten the rollers bigtime and mayne even go to a 1500 spring too.

Also did the boss come with the variator or did you buy it seperately? You may benefit from shortening the boss down a touch. Best thong to do is draw a line on the variator face with a magic marker, from the centre out to the edge, go for a ride at full speed and see how far up the variator the belt rides, as it rides up it will rub off the marker so if theres any marker left the the belt is not travelling to itsoter limit and youre losing top end speed.

I run 5.1g rollers, 1500 torque spring, race variator, shorter smooth boss = 45-48mph on flats, 30-40(ish) mph up hills, 50-52mph downhill.

[Peters]

I just learned about this extra length of the boss in the other thread. I had never heard of it before now. I have the multi var too. That's a good idea to use the magic marker to see how far up the belt is going... +1 

I have really been neglecting my CVT. I get great power from about 30 to 50 where I cruise. After 50 the power really drops off. Never really drops below 45 at WOT though. Unless it's a big hill. I guess I've been afraid to mess with it. I just know I can get at least another 5 mph without loosing acceleration.

[tuko]

Its sluggish because your using 8g rollers  

Stock weight is only 6.5g so your way over that. All that does it shift your gearing quicker so youre getting into high gear before you should be and losing the sweet spot. I could not ride my A50 on anything heavier than 5.5g-6g, even that is too heavy for me, i use 5.1g rollers and im on a 1500rpm torque spring where youre only on a 1000rpm one!!! Lighten the rollers bigtime and mayne even go to a 1500 spring too.

Also did the boss come with the variator or did you buy it seperately? You may benefit from shortening the boss down a touch. Best thong to do is draw a line on the variator face with a magic marker, from the centre out to the edge, go for a ride at full speed and see how far up the variator the belt rides, as it rides up it will rub off the marker so if theres any marker left the the belt is not travelling to itsoter limit and youre losing top end speed.

I run 5.1g rollers, 1500 torque spring, race variator, shorter smooth boss = 45-48mph on flats, 30-40(ish) mph up hills, 50-52mph downhill.

Streido,
Like I wrote earlier and again now, the lighter the roller I went (both 5.0g and 5.3g) the A50 would indeed get up to speed fast but it hit the wall at 25kph! By going up in weight I gained my speed back. I do admit that changing the contra spring does confuse the matter at hand.

The boss that came with the Naraku kit is 38mm long. Is that too short? Something is telling me that possibly 36mm is the ideal length?


Tuko.

[Peters]

25kph!

Sounds like something isn't right. You checked the width of the belt?

[streido]

I shaved my boss down to 36.8mm, 36mm may be too short   

I would def do the marker thing to see how its performing tho.  38mm is stock length, i ran mine like that for almost a yr till i fojnd out about shortening it down, got me an extra 3-5mph top speed. You may want to try a 1500 torque spring then?

Its only been in the last yr or so that folk have been saying 5.5g rollers seem too light in their newer A50's, all others like pre-2010/2011 all work well on 5.5's  I dont get it?? Your Agility left the factory with 6.5g rollers so you can safely assume they WILL work so maybe buy them or 6g's, those 8.5g ones just seem way too heavy to me unless you had a BBK installed. I would never be able to get up to top speed on rollers that heavy. Is it a stock belt your on?

[tuko]

As for the belt, seeing how the rest of the A50 has been I'll have to assume that it's never been changed.

I do have a 1500rpm contra spring maybe this weekend I'll give it a try. Plus I'll shave a mm from the boss.


Tuko.

[streido]

As for the belt, seeing how the rest of the A50 has been I'll have to assume that it's never been changed.

I do have a 1500rpm contra spring maybe this weekend I'll give it a try. Plus I'll shave a mm from the boss.


Tuko.

Do the spring 1st only and see how that is, if you shave the boss then that throws in a whole other set of variables. I would say its better to get the cvt set-up as best you can 1st with a stock boss then if you want to tune more do the boss. You may find its a lot closer to what you want with just the spring. Once you cut the boss that it cut so if it dont work well for you you need to buy a new boss.i always do 1 thing at a time cos if you mess with more than that you have no idea which thing isnt working out.

[mono]

always do 1 thing at a time cos if you mess with more than that you have no idea which thing isnt working out

Very true and often underestimated or temporarily forgotten !! We can not repeat this often enough !

I've learnt in a lot of hard ways that I should stick to this principle, even when I'm sure it won't be neccesary this time haha... 

[streido]

I've learnt in a lot of hard ways that I should stick to this principle, even when I'm sure it won't be neccesary this time haha...  

We all have, or will, at some point experienced this 

I dont even fully bolt on my cvt cover now till i had a few miles testing 1st, those bolts are a pain to undo again if a mod doesnt work well so i use 4 bolts, test it and if its good i put the rest back in.

[Peters]

Yep! 

It's so tempting when you get a box of parts in the mail to just throw everything on at one time. Fight the temptation 

[tuko]

Very true and often underestimated or temporarily forgotten !! We can not repeat this often enough !

I've learnt in a lot of hard ways that I should stick to this principle, even when I'm sure it won't be neccesary this time haha... 

Thanks for the advice guys, I will hold off for now. 

In the mean time I've ordered a new drive belt that I should have next week. I have no idea when the previous owner changed it, if they did at all. 



Tuko.