Rebuilding engine

[zombie]

Somethings are forever. Can't change the blood

[The Rookie]

Willfully starving a man to death is barbaric in any definition.

He starved himself to death, in fact there was a big furore over him being force fed to keep him alive!

[skippy]

lol what is going on here. my head is about to explode

[streido]

lol....... my head is about to explode

You get used to that and it just become the norm 

[zombie]

Margret Thatcher starved him to death. All she had to do was admit He was in fact a political prisoner, and reinstate IRA prisoners POW status under the Geneva Convention. It was a no brainer. Actually it did work out for the better. Modern Irish kids had a new Martor to look up to, and really everything has changed since  (except for one small patch of cancer that is dying off as we speak)

[streido]

Margret Thatcher starved him to death. All she had to do was admit He was in fact a political prisoner, and reinstate IRA prisoners POW status under the Geneva Convention. It was a no brainer. Actually it did work out for the better. Modern Irish kids had a new Martor to look up to, and really everything has changed since  (except for one small patch of cancer that is dying off as we speak)

  The number of Scots who are upset when the wicked old witch kicks it could be counted on one hand. She and her party are still hated here and i suspect always will be. Good ridance, just wish she would hurry up and get on with it so we can all celebrate. My beers are on ice 

[skippy]

burn the witch.

[zombie]

 

[The Rookie]

Margret Thatcher starved him to death. All she had to do was admit He was in fact a political prisoner, and reinstate IRA prisoners POW status under the Geneva Convention. It was a no brainer. Actually it did work out for the better. Modern Irish kids had a new Martor to look up to, and really everything has changed since  (except for one small patch of cancer that is dying off as we speak)

Kind of shows what a pathetic inept grasp of what happened you have and along with most americans kind of explains your fairly inept foreign policy over the years (Iraq...no strategy for after winning the war to win the peace).

Under the Geneva convention if the IRA were POW's theycould all have been shot for being out of uniform, something I'm sure they didn't want, but could ask for knowing it would never happen.

America was long a supporter of overseas terrorism but the attitude changed somewhat when you were on the recieving end, as soon as American support dried up the IRA came to the negotiating table and we now have relative peace in Northern Ireland.

He wasn't a political prisoner and therefor shouldn't have been called one, he was tried and convicted of criminal offences.

P.S. It's Martyr, not 'Irish kids' but the Catholic Minority in NI I presume you meant, the Irish mericans forget that the Majority of the Irish in NI want to be British, it's called self determination, something you Americans are usually keen on supporting.

[streido]

One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist.........guy was a hero and will be remembered by many for his sacrifice and bravery, or by others on the other side as some guy who starved himself. Thatcher on the other hand........well we all know about her and her legacy

Love them or loathe them, the PIRA DID help bring about the change to Ireland we see today, there is no denying this, it is fact. That rag-tag group of farmers, council estate dwellers and brave men & women managed to give as good as they got , they actually gave better than they got, and kept the might of the British Army at bay for 30 years and ultimately thro Sinn Fein, their political wing, they forced the change in civil rights and equality for all Catholic citizens that they now enjoy. The PIRA was formed in '69 to protect Catholic and Irish families who were burned out their homes in the north ny unionist/orange groups after the unionist Stormont Gov did nothing to protect them, and neither did the British btw until they sent in the British Army. It was the bias shown by the Brits toward the Unionists, the lack of civil rights for Irish and Catholics in the North, the propping up of the Unionist Stormont gov by the Brits, and the detention of hundreds of innocent young men who were interned in Long Kesh which drove most toward the Provos. Not many other movements, armies or militias can claim to have fought the British Army to a stale-mate. I would have signed up in a minute too if i had been Irish/Catholic and living under those conditions.

Ireland will be re-united, no doubt about it, its only a matter of time.

[Vivo]

Where's 080?.....

[streido]

Where's 080?.....

He's living under an assumed name, and dressed as a woman somewhere in bolivia. 

[The Rookie]

Your right Streido, the British Army was hamstrung by dealing with PIRA (or the more numerous loyalists paramilitary's) in a way that they didn't want to, as terrorists, had they truly operated a shoot on site war like campaign (one can think back to the Boer wars in South Africa) and been given a free reign it would have ended much sooner but would have been wrong in many ways (thinking of the Boer war again) The trouble is if you treat it as a war you do wrong (Boer concentration camps), treat it as terrorism and it makes putting and end to any 'violence' much harder.

The majority of Catholics in NI wanted a peaceful resolution, which is why only a minority of them voted Sinn Fein during the troubles, the Majority did not, once the terrorism stopped the lot of the many people in NI on both sides has been vastly improved, so the terrorists held up that advancement for 30 years, well done them, I bet 2 whole generations are pleased with that......

Before you get the wrong idea though, I have no more time for the 'Loyalist' (Oxymoron) thugs either.

[streido]

had they truly operated a shoot on site war like campaign

Like the SAS did in Gibraltar in Operation Flavius?

All 3 sides did wrong but the wrong of the Brits is only recently being revealed and most of it wont come out ever. It wasnt called the Dirty War for nothing. Im just glad its all pretty much over now apart from a few hardcore loons still trying to fan the flame again. Life is without a doubt much better for all now. I just get pissed when its made out the Brits where all saintly and the IRA were the demons cos both sides murdered innocents and both sides commited terrible acts for their own "cause". I would stand with anyone tho who is defending their own country from occupation. Things are no different now in other foreign lands where theBrits and Americans are made out to be the good guys and everyone who opposes them are "terrorists". Maybe is the US and UK stopped pushing and bullying everyone while they try to keep power and build their empires there wouldnt be so much bad feelings towards them. Least thats my take on the whole sh**ty mess.....

[The Rookie]

Just to correct one error (most the rest I agree with), Northern Island, under UN rules on self determination is British as the majority of the populace want it British (Rights and wrongs of segregation in the first place aside), as such there was no 'occupation'.

Mistakes happen when dealing with bomb plots (JC De Menezes) that doesn't mean it's a shoot to kill policy, and in fact the similarities are very obvious (except they really were bombers).

No doubt, Afghanistan is a classic really, we (US and Britain) take one side in a civil war and expect everyone to be grateful, as often happens the rights or wrongs get lost on the one side (who will now unite though they were infighting before) against the common 'enemy', no different to the many Germans who fought in WW2 who hated Hitler but fought for Germany.

Iraq could have worked, but it was blundered, demobbing the army and shutting down the Police was just stupid.