Why maxi scooters take so long to come to the USA market

[kingkymco125]

Hello everyone:

 I was speaking to one of the sales people at the local Vespa dealership here in Vegas about the maxi scooters.  They do not sell anything higher then the 300-350cc scooters. Vespa parent company, Piaggio makes the 500cc mp3 model. The gentleman told me it has everything to do with the strict emissions standards in the U.S. market. We know the Kymco 700cc Myland scooter has already been out in the market in Taiwan and other parts of the globe. Until the bikes have met this requirement, it takes quite awhile for the bike to come to market. Aprilia makes the 850cc scooters in Europe. The highest scooters Aprilia will sell in the U.S. is no more then the 500cc bikes. Compared to motorcycles, scooters are very different. BMW has met the requirements to sell their maxi scooters here as well as Suzuki which makes the 600 and 650cc bikes. Now you know why it could take forever for the 700cc scooters to arrive.

[Vivo]

To have to examine every angle....including corporate politics...

[ts1]

The gentleman told me it has everything to do with the strict emissions standards in the U.S. market.

I doubt there are more strict than in EU or Japan. But different.
As EU/Japanese approvals won't be acknowledged, the manufacturer has to calculate if the sales numbers justify this expensive effort.

I.e. tiny little Germany has bought 1.342 MP3-500 last year (private buyers only). And it was not even the best selling scoot in Germany!
You can image that in scooter nations like Italy or France the sales volume can exceed 10.000 for a single popular make.
And all EU nations accept EU approvals, so the common market is enough for ca. x.000 units for small players and beyond y00.000 for big players.

What are the US sale volumes?

[kingkymco125]

I will have to look into what the U.S. sales volume for maxi scooters are.

[Vivo]

Before, there are scooters and motorcycles... and both have very specific markets... Now, you have maxi scooters that is on a higher level competing with touring motorcycles like goldwings, etc.  Maybe the market is still not that big...

[kingkymco125]

When one looks at the average price of the maxi scooters, they think to themselves for this much money I could buy a used motorcycle, or car. Gas prices are in fact starting to go up again, but this not mean the public will go out and buy the bigger scoots. Here in Vegas, I have seen everyone riding the small Chinese 50cc scooters. Unless one has been riding for awhile they will not consider investing in a 125cc or higher scooter. If Vespa did not think there was a demand for their scooters in the Vegas market, they would not of evening opening up a dealership. Motorcycles are big in Vegas. The culture is starting to change for the scooters here, but it will take quite awhile for this to happen. The reason I decided to get a bigger scooter was for the increased horsepower. My 50cc could barely do 45mph. Now that I have my 125cc bike, keeping up with traffic is a breeze. My next scooter I want to buy is a 300cc maxi scooter. I would be able to go on the freeway and actually do long rides. I love all kinds of scooters and I know I will continue to ride even after I finally have my M license. Would I consider buying a motorcycle? Maybe, but I love scooters for their automatic shifting instead of the manual transmissions that are on motorcycles. Besides real men do ride scooters no matter what anyone says.

[Vivo]

And the Chinese are not far behind....

[Mike Green]

I really miss my Exciting500Ri. What a joy to ride that big mama. She was always powerful and precise and never a days bit of trouble. However the wreck with the deer was so intense and injuries were severe. It created a two wheel phobia in my wife that actually manifested itself in Shingles. She was adamant about no more two wheelers. We looked into a trike conversion and research revealed that these scooter trikes could become unstable and flip at high speeds so the Can Am Spyder was my only option if I wanted to continue to ride. So now I have an 09 RS that is a lot more powerful and easier to ride but it is no Exciting. Maybe one day I'll get another one but I will need a good divorce lawyer. Mike

[kingkymco125]

Mike, I know what you mean about the deer. I worked at a rental car company for one year and I saw all the damage the deers would cause to the vehicles. It is hard to believe that a species like this could literally total a vehicle, but it is true. I would not have believed if I did not see this with my own eyes. The deers may be cute, but they will win every time they go up against a car, or truck at full speeds. This is the god honest truth.

[houndguy]

I think it's changing slowly but surely.

Before I don't believe many dealers thought they would make any $$ from scoots, but now your seeing a lot more Chinese 50's out there.  It is the fastest growing segment of the motorcycle market.  The dealerships will want a piece of that market, knowing that the little 50cc is not going to serve the purpose of most commuters.

I think the motorcycle marketer's realized that there was not a mid range motorcycle in the market for a long time.  Look around now and your seeing a reintroduction of the 250's, the 650's and 700's.  Your also seeing a movement towards automatic shifting.  Woman are also the fastest growing segment of riders.  They need storage and again, now your seeing more storage on bikes.  Maxi-scooters fill all those needs.   

Increasing urbanization will also drive the market.  When you look at the advertising for the BMW scoots it's all about "urbanization."    I think BMW realizes that there is a growing market for maxi-scoots and mid-range motorcyles and they want to be at the forfront of it.  While America will never be as scoot filled as China, I can see the day coming where motorcycles/scooters will be more common. 

Gas prices will get worse.  That is a given.  While some cars are capable of 50+ MPG, bikes are still cheaper and generally get a higher MPG. 

So give it 5 more years.  You will see more Maxi's out on the roads.

 

[Vivo]

Popularity of scooters and small motorbikes will really depend on a lot of factors in the U.S. I am not an American so I can only guess.  You have big SUVs, big sedans, drunk drivers, etc. and longer travel distances than, say, Europe or Asia... a lot of Americans would still prefer a car for travel although the scooter is gaining it's popularity.  I have a brother and relatives in the U.S.. My brother drives a van and a pick-up truck and won't even consider a motorbike...more so a scooter.  My relatives there have SUVs...  Maybe around 10 to 15 years more, it would be a different scenario... that is if electric vehicles or hybrids won't become more popular....

[houndguy]

Popularity of scooters and small motorbikes will really depend on a lot of factors in the U.S. I am not an American so I can only guess.  You have big SUVs, big sedans, drunk drivers, etc. and longer travel distances than, say, Europe or Asia... a lot of Americans would still prefer a car for travel although the scooter is gaining it's popularity.  I have a brother and relatives in the U.S.. My brother drives a van and a pick-up truck and won't even consider a motorbike...more so a scooter.  My relatives there have SUVs...  Maybe around 10 to 15 years more, it would be a different scenario... that is if electric vehicles or hybrids won't become more popular....

This is an issue.     But data shows more and more movement back to the cities for most American's.  It just makes sense to be closer to work, closer to the core of where most things happen.   Although hybrid and electric vehicles are certainly part of the answer I still expect maxi-scooters (and scooters n general) to become more and more popular.   For example you can put something like 7 motorcycles into 1 standard parking space. 

As urbanization continues in the US, gas continues to raise and our infrastructure continues to fail...I see more and more movement to a "scooter culture."

[kingkymco125]

For the U.S. I would say one variable is the culture of the cities. The cities on the east coast such as my hometown New York, Boston, Baltimore, Philly, and D.C.  have embraced public transit. Scooters in these cities are a natural fit. When one looks at the cities in the southwest such as Vegas and Phoenix, it is a different story. These cities have been built around the automobile and freeways. Public transportation is not as good in these cities as it back east. In L.A. the scooter culture is alive and well which is shocking. We know the automobile is what built L.A.  There are many more scooter dealerships in L.A. then almost anywhere else. I know of at least 4 scooter clubs there. If scooters can be embraced in the L.A. metro area then the rest of the USA can embrace the scooter culture and lifestyle.
When BMW introduced their 600 and 650cc maxi scooters to the media, they did it in L.A.  As gas prices continue to go up scooter sales will increase. Scooters offer you freedom to go when and where you want without few restrictions. I have taken Vegas mass transit and it stinks. My 125cc scooter is my only means of transportation at this time, but she gets me to where I need to go.  The Chinese scooters may be great, but those who want a quality scooter will consider the better quality bikes. They know that something built so cheap will have many more problems. Vespa might be more expensive because of the brand, but the Kymco brand is just as good.

[Vivo]

KingKymco, I was just thinking of that "culture" thing you mentioned and I think you nailed that. Personally, if electric vehicles becomes the in thing, I still would be on a scooter... Freedom is what a scooter is... In my older days (70's) scooters are for girls riding in subdivisions/ villages... now they are used for touring along with big bikes.  Right now, there are around 4 million registered motorcycles in my small country and growing by the minute... we now have motorcycle lanes on the main roads and motorcycle parking spaces in malls.  Going back to the topic, I think the popularity of small up to mid sized scoots 50-150cc would be more than the maxis in the years to come. If one travels around 30 - 40 miles in a day, I think a 300 or 500cc would just not be too practical...  I have a Super 8 but I'm thinking in getting another but smaller one for more "flexibility". 

[jprestonian]

I only have this to add.

First mistake: believing a salesperson.

Seriously. I've been one. Even the most well-intentioned ones will misinform you on trivial matters, 'cause "that's what they heard from the sales manager," etc.

The average sales droid will often engage in creative (even if not particularly germane to closing the sale) fabrication, just to sound more knowledgeable than they actually are.

The really bad ones will tell you whatever they think you want to hear, and the downright evil ones will convince you that up is down.
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